h a l f b a k e r yIdea vs. Ego
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Since it is increasingly apparent that the Executive and Legislature of the United States are unable collectively to run a bath, let alone a nuclear-armed global superpower*, all current and prospective elected Federal representatives should be required to take and pass a mandated class in personal cleanliness
techniques before being allowed to assume office.
*Allegedly
H L. Mencken
http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki
Oh dear. [8th of 7, Oct 15 2013]
[link]
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Next up, the Brits will be giving lectures about the fine art of dentistry... |
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//Executive and Legislature of the United States// |
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Could this clique not more appropriately be named
"Authorized Nominees of the United States"? |
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Or we could all gird our loins and get down to the hard work of building a new system that actually worked. The only reason why we keep this turd of a system is because as a people we are to gutless to change it for something better. Frankly this country lacks the intellect and sense of personal responsibility necessary to maintain a democracy. Likely we never did /have such/; which explains so much of the mythology in our history. |
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//this country lacks the intellect and sense of
personal responsibility necessary to maintain a
democracy. Likely we never did;// |
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I think the American government is working exactly the way in which it was designed to work, and it only looks messy from the outside (and as seen through the eyes of media who have an interest in making things seem apocalyptic because then you'll watch more). |
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// Or we could all gird our loins and get down to the hard
work of building a new system that actually worked. // |
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If my house is on fire, some people will come with a big red
truck and put it out. If my car gets stolen (unlikely), a man
in a blue uniform will come and listen to me complain
about it. When my kid's old enough to go to school, a lady
will come in a long yellow bus to take him there. |
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Based on that evidence, I'd say the primary functions of our
government are working just fine. If you'd like to scrap it
all and build something that you think is better (which is an
easily attainable goal for those who can sustain two or
three years of open warfare), feel free to try. Be a sport
and pick up the mess when you're done, eh? |
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// big red truck … man in a blue uniform …
long yellow bus // |
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And are these services financed and provided
at a local, regional or national level ? |
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Apart from the over-arching function of
defence (in its widest sense, including border
control etc.), a prerequisite for the continuing
existence of the classic nation-state, what
does central government actually do that's
useful to its citizens ? And, more importantly,
provide value for money ? |
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As a purveyor of pre-girded loins, available in a choice of polyester, lurex or teak.... |
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Hmm, I suspect our transatlantic cousins have the same taste in farce as in the old country. At least they're missing out on the Black Rod and/or cricket malarkey. |
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//I think the American government is working exactly the way in which it was designed to work, and it only looks messy from the outside // |
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The Federalist Papers, No. 22: 'To give a minority a negative upon the majority ... is, in its tendency, to subject the sense of the greater number to that of the lesser. ... Its real operation is to embarrass the administration, to destroy the energy of the government, and to substitute the pleasure, caprice or artifices of an insignificant, turbulent or corrupt junto to the regular deliberations and decisions of a respectable majority.' |
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This tyranny of the minority, Hamilton wrote, would result in 'tedious delays; continual negotiation and intrigue; contemptible compromises of the public good.' Sound familiar? James Madison agreed, later writing in The Federalist Papers, No. 58, that by letting a minority faction run rogue, 'the fundamental principle of free government would be reversed. It would be no longer the majority that would rule: the power would be transferred to the minority.' Madison wrote that the minority faction would be prone to extort unreasonable indulgences." |
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"Under democracy one party always devotes its chief energies to trying to prove that the other party is unfit to rule — and both commonly succeed, and are right...The United States has never developed an aristocracy really disinterested or an intelligentsia really intelligent. Its history is simply a record of vacillations between two gangs of frauds." |
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// Madison wrote that the minority faction would be prone to extort unreasonable indulgences. |
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Yes, they wrote a lot about those things, but still they created a government that permits exactly that to happen. No one has broken any rules. The government is operating within its parameters. It appears designed to break, just as it is doing. Let the damage be done and hopefully wiser electors will prevail next time. |
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Poor planning, for certain. I'm not suggesting that the founders were wise in this. But if everyone is operating within the law, then the government is working as it should. If people are not satisfied with that, then the law was poorly written and needs updating. |
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// And are these services financed and provided at
a local, regional or national level ? // |
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Provided locally, coordinated regionally, sanctioned
nationally, and financed at all three levels. It's
complicated, but the primary colors of government service
still benefit the individual taxpayer with graceful simplicity
when viewed from underneath. |
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// the primary colors of government service ... when viewed from underneath. // |
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Brown, then, and presumably from a great height. |
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It might be white, if we use the traditional eagle mascot. |
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The Founding Fathers spent far too much of their
time arguing about the proper balance of
representative powers for me to believe that they
would condone that a small minority of a minority
party should shut down government and bring its
debt-paying-ability grinding to a halt. |
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Also by Mencken: "To be an American is,
unquestionably, to be the noblest, grandest, the
proudest mammal that ever hoofed the verdure of
God's green footstool. Often, in the black abysm of
the night, the thought that I am one awakens me
with a blast of trumpets, and I am thrown into a
cold sweat by contemplation of the fact. I shall
cherish it on the scaffold; it will console me in
Hell. But there is no perfection under Heaven, so
even an American has his small blemishes, his
scarcely discernible weaknesses, his minute traces
of vice and depravity." |
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// ... that they would condone that a small minority of a minority .. |
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Didn't mean to suggest they would condone it, only that the system of government they created allows for it. Hence the poor planning bit. I'm suggesting that the founding fathers were not omniscient beings as they are often credited. |
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I think they were so jaded toward imperialism that they overcorrected, erred on the side of spreading out control, and in so doing, created the very situation we see today. |
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//I think they were so jaded toward imperialism
that they overcorrected// |
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Here in the UK we have a deeply flawed system of
government, but since our deep flaws are
different from your deep flaws, we just roll our
eyes at you lot. |
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One of the funniest things, from our perspective,
is that you lot all seem to do as you are told so
much of the time. We've long since learned to
ignore whatever the government tells us to do,
unless they keep telling us for several years, in
which case we throw them out and pick another
lot. |
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While the government is shut down, do the politicians still get paid ? |
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It would be amusing to see Barack panhandling for dimes outside 2200 Pennsylvania Avenue and then getting moved on by the cops ... |
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//As long as the roads are paved, plowed and salted
in the winter, we have emergency services (police,
fire, hospitals & ambulances), and we have sufficient
military resources to prevent foreign invasion, then
I'd say the government is working as it should. IDGAF
if it's handled at the state or federal level as long as
the shit gets handled// |
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Never mind that whole fiscal management thing. |
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I'm kinda partial to NASA, FEMA and the CDC. There are no small business loans, immunization programs or federally subsized daycare but nonetheless these are bonuses, not requirements. |
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I'd like to disassociate my comments from those who are arguing the government is working as it should. It may sound as though I'm in agreement with this view, as I've stated that the government is working as it was designed - and it is designed to permit bad things to happen through its misuse. None of this is how it SHOULD be however, that will take some fiddling withthe constiution. |
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// it is designed to permit bad things to happen through its misuse. // |
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Second Amendment. anyone ? |
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The 2nd Amendment was designed to thwart overly oppressive, not vacationing, government. |
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// it is designed to permit bad things to happen
through its misuse. // |
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No it most certainly is not. The founding fathers had a
plethora of flaws and foibles amongst them, but it is
ludicrous to think that they should have created a nation
with malice aforethought. Their design may suffer from a
few loopholes, but its intent was clear. |
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I'm not speaking of intention. I say permitted, not intended, and the last few weeks shows it quite readily. |
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//created a nation with malice aforethought//
This is a great idea (conceptually, at least), a colonialism driven by a desire to do it wrong. I suppose the easiest way to do this would be to replicate the Scramble for Africa. |
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Then it's your phrasing that set me off, [tatter]. To 'permit'
something implies intent, or at the very least knowledge
that it could or will happen. Saying that the Constitution
etc. is 'designed to permit' is saying that those who
composed our laws knew that they were leaving loopholes
and condoned their misuse. I do not believe this to be true.
Lack of foresight does not make their intent any less
altruistic. |
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Well, fair enough, it's a constitution, not the
Seldon Plan … |
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// Saying that the Constitution etc. is 'designed to permit' is saying that those who composed our laws knew that they were leaving loopholes and condoned their misuse. I do not believe this to be true. |
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I am in agreement with you. |
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I mean more of the passive sense of the word "permit" than the active connotation you are reading. |
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The system, working within constitutional parameters, nearly broke itself, and may well have the opportunity to do so again soon. This was surely not intended, but permitted by the rules of the game. I hope that clarifies. |
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1)America needs to get rid of the electoral college
system of voting, and move to popular vote. |
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2) An official equivocation has to be drawn between
fundamentalist christians and muslims because they're
coconspirators in a dialectical way to the destruction of
America. |
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3) George W Bush has to be held accountable for
American debt crisis. |
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4) America needs leaner government and higher taxes for
the next few decades. |
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5) The FBI needs to investigate the Republican Party's
efforts to downsize the American government, including
Bush's overspending and borrowing on Iraq that will limit
spending of every subsequent government for the next
century. |
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6). The Republican Party needs to divide into two
parties, one of bonnet wearing and sign signifying
uberfascists, and another party of true to name Irish or
French styled republicans. |
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7) The purposeful noise by right wing media that
destroys all meaning has to be deadened. |
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8). Israel has to thank everyone for their interest in
monotheism and historical goings on in that region, but
respectfully ask everyone in the world to frankly STFU
about it and move on with their meaningless lives
without Abraham, it was all a lot of fun, but now there's
bosons, asteroids and other shit to worry about, and
nobody who has ever died on a cross or otherwise is
coming back, and also show a diagram illustrating the
difference between god and a book and where to draw
the line. |
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9) Obama has to give his speeches holding a gun. |
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10) The right wing of the American bald eagle needs to
be clipped because flying in a circle is better than falling
to the ground. |
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[rcarty], please, find another soapbox location on
which to stand for awhile. |
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The system that needs fixing is not the electoral
college, but the inherent inefficiency and expense
being driven by having the party in charge of one
branch of government not be able to be in charge
of execution of law. Our governmental programs
seem excessively expensive and inept in
comparison to other nations, and I suspect that
laws designed in the sausage farm of party
compromise in order to get past one branch of
government or the other may be a big part of the
problem in that they are rendered toothless or
hopelessly arcane upon issuance to the delight of
the opposing party. |
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We need a parliamentary style of governance. |
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