h a l f b a k e r yApply directly to forehead.
add, search, annotate, link, view, overview, recent, by name, random
news, help, about, links, report a problem
browse anonymously,
or get an account
and write.
register,
|
|
|
Please log in.
Before you can vote, you need to register.
Please log in or create an account.
|
Humans and other air-breathing creatures show degraded
mental and physical performance at high altitude. This is
because there is less oxygen. There's less of everything else
too, but we don't need to worry about nitrogen and the
CO2 situation may help a little. Anyhow, the problem is
low atmospheric
pressure causes low O2 partial pressure
that diminishes the extent and rate of O2 movement from
lungs across all the gooey bits to hemoglobin.
One way climbers or specialist aircrew solve the problem is
to supplement with pure O2. This increases the partial
pressure of O2 by increases the percentage. This works but
is inconvenient and expensive. Regular airliners solve the
problem by simply compressing air with a turbojet, this is
clearly the cheaper and more sustainable option.
What's happening in the jet engine itself is super
interesting. Jet engines and turbocharged car engines don't
really suffer from the effects of altitude. At high altitude,
more energy is needed to compress the air to the required
pressure, BUT as air moves from the combustion chamber
through the turbines to the atmosphere that extra energy
can be re=captured. The beauty is that it's always
proportional.
Let us consider humans as a candidate for turbocharging.
The human, like an engine, can simply be considered as an
air pump. Now, we have a tidal intake and exhaust moving
through the same tubing and addition of a valve train and a
camshaft is possibly an upgrade for the future, but for now
we will have to deal with that. The typical turbocharger
uses an extremely high-speed centrifugal compressor and
turbine sections that are not suitable to the human
lubrication system*. Instead, a Wankel or vane
pump/turbine is the way to go.
So, you breathe out, your diaphragm increases pressure in
your lungs. The air moves up and out through the tubing
into the SCUBA-style mouthpiece. Here a one-way valve
directs air to the turbine. Air turns the turbine that is
linked to the compressor. The compressor feeds a
polymeric variable-volume pressure storage tank** where it
waits until the exhalation ends and the intake is initiated.
Again, a one-way valve opened by a partial vacuum is the
way to go.
Now the lung pressure can be maintained at an
advantageous level making Everest an easy stroll.
*more upgrade potential here.
**A balloon with a logo and $200 mark up.
Transhimalayan Geese
https://www.pnas.org/content/108/23/9516
[bs0u0155, May 16 2019]
[link]
|
| |
This is presumably great up to the moment when your
alveoli all rupture. |
|
| |
Surely all this mechanization is a bit passé? Many species
cope quite well with much lower oxygen pressures than we
do, and in some cases this is because they have a different
haemoglobin, optimised for altitude. It would be far
eleganter to swap out our haemoglobin genes than to install
all this mechanical gubbins. We should probably start by
looking at those geese that migrate over mountains. |
|
| |
Now, if you really must tinker mechanically, I'd suggest a
more organic approach, and go for some sort of
countercurrent exchange mechanism. This might need a bit
of re-plumbing, but any decent vascular surgeon could
knock this up using spare bits of leg vein. |
|
| |
//swap out our haemoglobin genes// |
|
| |
Ah, I see. Increase the affinity of hemoglobin and the O2
leaps enthusiastically onto it. Of course the O2 will then
steadfastly remain on the hemoglobin on its travels
through the various tissues. You'd need to up the affinity
of everything downstream. |
|
| |
//those geese that migrate over mountains// |
|
| |
Presumeably there must be a mechanism as I
doubt geese have 2-3 fold excess aerobic capacity. |
|
| |
Supposing, that is, you have a spare leg or two ... |
|
| |
Both approaches strike us as lacking in flair and imagination. |
|
| |
One of the waste products of respiration is water. |
|
| |
Use a condenser to collect liquid water from the exhaled gases. From a Seebeck-effect device attached to the user, convert body heat to electricity. Use the electricity to electrolyse the water. Feed the oxygen back to the intake side via a demand valve. Burn the hydrogen in ambient air and use the heat in another Seebeck-effect generator to boost the electrolysis. Et viola ! A portable oxygen enricher with no moving parts. |
|
| |
What could possibly go wrong ? |
|
| |
Using a turbine/compressor pair will lose a lot of efficiency.
Since the system is "oscillating" (it's only ever in OR out flow,
never both at once), you can use a simple pressure-
exchange, like a solid container with a movable or flexible
membrane in the middle. Exhalation into one side
pressurises the other side, which opens for inhalation (with
breath-operated valves and such...). |
|
| |
// like a solid container with a movable or flexible
membrane in the middle.// |
|
| |
I thought of that. Problem is, it's a little simple and
would necessitate the removal of both complexity
and the word "Wankel" from this idea. |
|
| |
Goingback to our water-splitting idea, there's an improvement ; since hydrogen is just protons, use them to make more oxygen from the abundant atmospheric nitrogen by just adding a proton to each nitrogen nucleus; you even have a spare electron to keep the charge balanced. |
|
| |
//O2 will then steadfastly remain on the hemoglobin// Well,
not necessarily. Our own haemoglobin changes its oxygen
affinity in response to (I think) CO2 concentrations or pH or
something. That affinity shift just needs to be greater. |
|
| |
// Burn the hydrogen in ambient air // |
|
| |
The exhaust of said burn might perhaps be ducted to the
rear of the user during events such as running or mountain
climbing, to boost them forwards, closer to the goal and
thus less in need of oxygenated air. |
|
| |
//oxygen affinity in response to (I think) CO2
concentrations or pH or something.// |
|
| |
CO2 is part of the altitude story. Because of the low
pressure, it moves off hemoglobin into the gaseous
phase easily. That leads to a systemic alkalosis
which can mess with the hemoglobin affinities in the
tissues. |
|
| |
Well, the solution to systemic alkalosis is obviously to include
a larger-than-usual slice of lemon in the G&T. |
|
| |
//include a larger-than-usual slice of lemon in the G&T// |
|
| |
There's no free lunch. The increased acid from the lemon
will drive CO2 out of solution in the tonic. The CO2 is
already racing out of solution due to the reduced
pressure. Since it would be prudent to increase the
percentage of Gin as a precaution against freezing, that
decreases CO2 solubility. There's almost everything
working against bubbly tonic here. For high altitude
operations, I think there's something to be said for the
sheer efficiency of a well-mixed martini. Losing the anti-
malarial efficacy isn't such a problem on mountains. |
|
| |
//a well-mixed martini// so, just the gin, then? Yes, I can
see that working. I'm prepared to do the proof-of-concept
studies. |
|
| |
Blimey. It's difficult to maintain the venier of civilization if
you've resorted to swilling straight gin. No, a well mixed
martini is cold gin, in a glass, with 3 olives. If you want a
stiff drink, you can always reduce the olive count. |
|
| |
I was taking the olives as a given. |
|
| |
The alveoli rupturing could be suppressed by a corresponding increase in blood pressure. |
|
| |
Portable oxygen concentrators are baked, but I wonder if you could build a hand-cranked one? Probably a bit demanding but if you were only aiming to partially increase the oxygen concentration it might be acceptable. |
|
| |
Would it not, all in all, be easier to bring whatever it is down
to a lower altitude so we can look at it in comfort? I'm
thinking that the top, say, 20ft of Mount Everest could make a
very nice water feature for someone. And, as a bonus, the
actual mountain would be 20ft easier to climb, and would
have a nice flat top so you could stop and have a cup of tea. |
|
| |
That suggestion makes table mountain and the
anomalous kilimanjaro look suspicious. |
|
| |
Some measurement on the pyramids might be in order. Never
trust an Egyptian builder. |
|
| |
I would think there could be a solid business case for flying a helicopter to the top of Mount Everest, scooping up some of whatever material the top of Everest is made of, and bringing it back. The material could be ground and made into little flat tiles perhaps 12" square. Gullible rich people could spend a serious wodge of lolly on buying one, and having it Installed in their home or garden so that they could enjoy their G&T "standing on the top of Mount Everest". |
|
| |