h a l f b a k e r yVeni, vedi, fish velocipede
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//It might be possible to engineer a fly with a built in mp3
recorder// |
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Or, on the other hand, it might not. |
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Once again, the word "How?" rears it's ugly head. |
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“OK, let’s hear the incriminating evidence, agent Beelzebub”
<clicks <play>>
“zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz...” |
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[MB] I think there's even more elided technical detail hiding under
//collect them//. But see <link>. |
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Obviously, they operate in pairs, and when one dies, the partner carries it back to HQ. (a) and (b) solved. |
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//Not if they have the same lifespan.// They could have the
same lifespan if one partner is younger than the other. One
old, experienced, cynical, "doesn't follow the rules" partner,
and one fresh, idealistic "fresh out of the cyborg insect
academey" partner -- just like in the movies. |
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Engineer the flys to be attracted to a pheromone, to draw them back to a collection spot after release. I think a flys genome might contain enough space to hold maybe a few days worth of a mp3 recording, we could engineer them to pass on the parents recording to the next generation to prevent data loss. The next generation has no record functionality, they just replicate the parents data. |
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I spy with my little fly..... welcome to the halfbakery [ddn3] - you appear to be "new". |
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This is not a new idea, and it will therefore attract negativity. |
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It's not really a feasible idea either - or even unfeasible in an interesting or amusing way - so it will attract even more negativity. |
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// a flys [sic] genome might contain enough space to hold
maybe a few days worth of a mp3 recording,// |
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Yes, but now you're wanting to develop some way for a fly
to convert sound into a DNA sequence (easy
computationally; difficult biologically) and then
incorporate this sequence into its genome. |
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Plan B: develop chewing-gum which can record sound.
Drop packs of gum over enemy territory. Eventually the
gum will be chewed and then dropped. Then develop a
breed of cat with especially hairy feet. Train cats to walk
through enemy territory, picking up the gum on their hairy
feet, then herd them into a data-collection centre where
they walk through a trough of chewing-gum solvent. |
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Plan C: we start with a simple aardvaark.... |
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What gets me about this, or one of the things for there are several, is the MP3 bit. Does that not mean there needs to be some kind of trig function calculation going on? Could there maybe be some kind of lookup table in DNA form? Would it not be easier to use just a tiny piggyback computer to do all this? |
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Incidentally, i am very enthusiastic about this idea, not because i think it'll work but because it has so many obstacles to working. It's like using backwards capacitors to travel in time. |
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And again incidentally, whereas i was thinking of Drosophila, houseflies have different lifespans according to their sex. One sex lives seventeen days and the other twenty-nine here in England, if i remember rightly. |
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I'm just so curious how someone joins the hb 8 years ago and then finally decided to post an idea?
anyway- hello there [ddn3]!! |
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I joined years ago but just recently found this site
again. I was searching for information on fly wheel
batteries and this site popped up. I found my old
account and just decided to post some ideas
floating
in my head. |
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I think mircoengineering millions of mp3 recorders
and then implanting them into flies is harder than
genetically engineering them to be mp3 recorders
form the get go. It is quite possible to attach
artificial chromosomes onto existing creatures
genomes have have those carry on to the next
generation. The hard part of converting digital
information into an arbitrary length of DNA might
be problematic, but truthfully I think we can use
another information carrier molecule for artificial
life forms than DNA. Is it far out there? Probably
not, i suspect artificial life to be possible
in 1-2 years and then things will move very quickly
after that. |
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As for programming the mp3 recorder using just
bio-molecules, were almost to that point where
we can do translation of digital operations ->
bio-molecular operations. |
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The thing is, if I were going to try this, I'd probably start with
a species that has ears. Hence the aardvark. It's probably
easier to get and aardvark to fly than it would be to get a flay
to do ard vark. |
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Drosophila apparently live for a month as adults. I think this estimate is too low, though it could be that that's in captivity and predation and the like usually kill them earlier. Then again, if they are predated, there would seem to be a problem retrieving the information. Mayflies, on the other hand, live about five hours as adults, but again get eaten a lot. In fact everything gets eaten a lot or decomposes, which is almost the same. |
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But, is MP3 a suitable format? What about using the flies' memories? |
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I have to say that i'm having serious difficulty accepting that biological computers can be made with the same specifications as digital hardware and more easily. |
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Actually, I have a feeling they skip the eating bit. |
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//is MP3 a suitable format?// |
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Only if you can compress on the fly. |
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// a hastily published “Not The Nine O’Clock News” book,// |
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Ooh! Was that the sort of A4-sized soft-cover Christmas rip-
off edition? For some reason, Ghryff Rhees-Jhones himself
was in a special booth at a London train station selling and
signing copies of it one Christmas ages ago. I bought a copy,
and he asked me what to write in the dedication. I said I
thought he was supposed to be the creative one. |
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As it happens, that very book should be within reach as i type but someone's moved it. |
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Mayflies are a good example of why anthropomorphism doesn't work. If a human being threw themselves into the river and started to drown, you'd probably think it would be good to rescue them. If a mayfly did the same, it would make its whole life pointless. |
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I believe flies have ears or ear like structures, as
most insects do. I wouldn't use a large animal because they are not "disposable" as insects are.
Raising 1 million aardvarks for an infiltration
mission is not feasible, but raising 1 million
genetically engineered flies is a snap, all u need is
a fridge size container and some spoiled food. |
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Well the idea was also to meant to raise the
question about the possibilities of biological
engineered machines, which is coming i believe
very soon. |
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// Raising 1 million aardvarks for an infiltration mission is
not feasible,// |
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I dispute this. Given a modest investment into research
on aardvark breeding, I see no reason why they should be
more difficult to breed than, say, dogs or humans.
Looking to modern intensive farming methods for
inspiration, I think it ought to be possible to run several
hundred head of aardvark on a ten acre plot (or "dijkveldt",
as the breeding ground of an aardvark is known). Based on
figures for raising pigs and sheep, I think the cost could be
brought down to maybe $10 per adult 'vark, or $10,000,000
in total to raise the necessary megaardvark platoon (or
"weeklujke", as a collection of aardvarks is known). This is
well within military budgets. |
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There is also a precedent for mass aardvarkiculture. In the
1970's, the Soviet Union attempted to breed large numbers
of these creatures to release into some of the more
southerly parts of their territory (Uzbekhistan,
Turkmenistan and Kannunastan). The theory was that
these animals - who are prodigious diggers - would help to
break up the wind-panned topsoil of these regions,
reducing rain runoff and producing a more fertile
environment for agriculture. (As a bonus, it turns out that
ardvaark droppings, or "spjoore", are extremely rich in
both iron and silicates, two components which are in
limited supply in these regions.) |
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A weeklujke of over 30,000 ardvaarks (three males to each
female, since this is the ratio in which they breed) was
raised on four massive collective farms in the southern
USSR, and released along the border between Uzbekhistan
and Turkmenistan. Five years later, there had been quite
considerable improvement in soil turnover and structure
(and, allegedly, a reduction in runoff-related flooding in
the area). However, the original population diminished
rather than increased, and the animals did not spread out
more than a few kilometres from their release site.
Attempts at air-dropping aardvarks in pairs over wider
areas failed, because of the female aardvark's ability to
reflexively evert her ovaries in response to a perceived
threat or unexpected shock (such as being dropped out of
a Kamov Ka-27 from 2000 feet). |
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Nevertheless, it's clear that aardvark breeding on a large
scale is feasible. |
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Moreover, it is considerably easier to locate and retrieve
an aardvark than it is a housefly, particularly in situations
where aardvarks are not indigenous, ensuring that most
recovered aardvarks are likely to be your own. |
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Aardvarks are totally unsuitable for military application
because aardvark never killed anybody. |
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//aardvarks never killed anybody// they don't get caught you mean |
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