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(First of all, sorry for the excessive hyphenation above.)
This is my dream product! I hate applying and re-applying sunblock and worrying about how long I've been outside in the hot sun, etc. Stick some super sunblock stuff into a body wash and the stuff will sell like hot cakes. Why?
1.
Including it in a shower product many people already use and many more won't mind starting to use will save everyone time by eliminating the extra step of applying sunblock to exposed skin. You'd be putting it on while showering, so there's no additional application time.
2. Eliminate that greasiness that, let's face it, is there at least temporarily even with those "greaseless" formulas. Forget having greasy hands and feeling sticky from putting half a bottle of Coppertone on.
3. Forget missed spots. Using an all-over product like body wash gets EVERYTHING covered, including your eyelids, ears, back of your neck, armpits, etc. (I once missed a spot near my armpit and it was the only spot that was burned on my skin...for a week!) And forget tan lines if you don't want them. ;) You're covered EVERYWHERE. You can feel free to head for the nude beach without fear someone will catch you applying lotion suspiciously to your member.
4. Apply once a day (or every time you shower) and forget about it. You can go outside whenever you want, blistering sun or not, for a few minutes or all day long. This stuff would be built to stay on (or in) your skin indefinitely for constant protection from the sun. (Our ozone layer will most likely never be restored, so more protection can only be better.) Forget about having to remember to reapply after spending 2 hours outside. Lose track of time and relax and play in the sun!
5. It would be waterproof, too, so there'd be no exceptions for the "shower and forget about it" attitude. Going swimming today? No problem. Hop in the shower, slather on your favorite body wash, complete with super sunblocker ingredient built-in, and go. Be protected no matter what activities you choose for the day.
6. Protect your skin all year-round, even when most people don't think to put on sunblock - like wintertime. The sun is out all year and as time goes on, we'll be ever less protected by our depleting ozone layer. Using a product like this all the time will prevent that first nasty wave of inevitable wintertime sunburns.
Protect yourself, your kids, the entire population without fuss or mess. I think this wonderful ingredient should become standard for all soaps and body washes. We may even want it in our shampoo to protect our scalps and hair.
This stuff can take us back to a time when we weren't afraid of skin cancer or blistering sunburns. It will free us from having to lug that extra bottle of gunk to the beach or picnic. Free us from the feeling we've been out in the sun too long when out swimming (without a watch on). It's like wearing a protective suit on all the time, so you don't have to worry about whether it's on or not. It would need to stay in your skin, like moisturizing agents, so you won't have to feel it's presence or really ever think about it.
One added side-benefit: it would teach people to wash more thoroughly, especially if they skip areas, like feet or something, and go out and get burned in just those spots. The world will be cleaner and smell nicer just because stinky/lazy people don't like getting sunburned either. ;)
Coppertone Sport
http://www.epinions...eatproof_Dry_Lotion
Dry, ultra sweat/waterproof lotion. [waugsqueke, Jun 04 2002]
The Sta-Puft Marshmallow Man
http://www.sandys-c...roducts/t/60004.jpg
[phoenix, Jun 04 2002, last modified Oct 04 2004]
Who needs body wash?
http://www.cyberspaceplaza.co.uk/deeptan/
Just use melanin. If you're not already black, brown or khaki, buy your melanin tablets here. [DrCurry, Jun 07 2002, last modified Oct 04 2004]
(??) Flip Soap
http://www.flipsoap.com
[ShortyDog]'s Link; It's close, but no cigar [XSarenkaX, Oct 04 2004]
KLEN
http://www.klenskin.com/
This idea has supposedly been "baked" by KLEN. Anyone care to try this and let us know if it's up to snuff? [XSarenkaX, Jan 25 2010]
AQUEA SCIENTIFIC
http://aqueascienti...on.com/research.php
Here's the research behind the baked version of this idea. [XSarenkaX, Jan 25 2010]
KLEN's Technology
http://www.klenskin...reen-technology.php
They finally put their research online now. [XSarenkaX, Feb 01 2010]
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Also, it should be noncomodogenic. |
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Yes, and safe for sensitive skin. This product would be the end-all be-all of sunblocks!! |
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I wonder if the greasiness of current products is required to keep the sunblock agent emulsified. Anyone know? |
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My only stipulation -- it still must be available in coconut scent. Otherwise, no matter how much I try to believe, I will not be convinced that I have sunscreen on. |
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This stuff would have to be available for all soaps and body washes - including the coconut smelling kind. ;) |
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I don't see how it would be possible to apply sunscreen while showering. You're washing stuff off your skin in the shower, not putting stuff on it. |
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[waugsqeke] It's waterproof so it *never* comes off. A year later, you look like the Sta-Puft Marshmallow man. |
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waugsqeke, I imagine it's a bit like all those fancy additives in some makeup and cleansers these days to help women look younger and feel softer, etc. Moisturizers have been in cleansers for a while now - why not take it to a new level and deposit some more useful stuff into our skins? |
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phoenix, I thought the stuff would persist for a maximum of 24 hours, just enough time to get you from one daily shower to the next. I don't think anything lasts indefinitely. Even tatoos fade. That's why I suggested the constant use. It's round-the-clock protection that's practically invisible and weightless. |
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This would be better if it was in pill form. Having goop sprayed all over me in the shower doesn't sound very good. |
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Maybe I should have made this more clear, but I envisioned this magical sunblocker ingredient would be just that - an ingredient contained in your favorite soaps and body washes. The ingredient should not be detectable by touch - it is meant to be more like a vitamin additive or something to that effect. There is no "goop" to worry about. |
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If it makes you feel better XSX, thats what I had in mind from the get go. Lets bake this 'mo fo, I burn easily and I like the beach. The two just don't combine. |
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I'm not at all sure about this idea. Viewed lightly, it seems good - health conscious, protective of kids who don't know how to protect themselves, and yes, there's always a bit of yourself you can't reach (like that no-man's-land in the centre of your back which you can't get your hand to stretch to..)
But on the other hand, it's all very nanny-state. I'm just not sure I am happy about "them" putting yet another chemical into consumer products. They already put folic acid into flour, and some places there's extra fluorine in the drinking water. For this reason I simply disagree with this part: //I think this wonderful ingredient should become standard for all soaps and body washes//. That statement also illustrates that unfortunately this idea is not really backed up by any plan of how to carry it out. The essence is fine, but we've not been given any suggested mechanism of how to get melatonin (sp.?) to sink into the skin from outside, like a moisturiser. Or how to super-fast metabolise proteins and Vitamin D... People think that "Pro-vitamins" in shampoo are good for your hair, or your skin - the suggestion of a vitamin, even to work on your (dead!) skin and hair cells, is exotic. The truth is that a pro-vitamin can be metabolised into a vitamin... but not by your hair. Along the same lines, vitamins and (I think) proteins are not absorbed by skin; there is no biological mechanism for this. The only things you can take by non-puncturing external mechanisms are moisturising agents and anaesthetics. So to me, it looks like you're stuck with smearing on the goop. In that case, re-align your efforts into (a) making the sunblock last longer without reapplication [I may return to this point another time because it is a fundamental principle of how sunblock works] and (b) making it smear on less goopily.
Oh, and those spray-on sunscreens - apparently the carrier liquid is much more viscous than the sunblock agent, so when you spray it on and massage it in, you may just be moving the carrier about. Spray liberally. |
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//Maybe I should have made this more clear, but I envisioned this magical sunblocker ingredient....// |
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So, you admit this is "magic"....that generally earns a [m-f-d] tag around here.... |
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perhaps *if* I had burn problems, I would be more sympathetic....but, as my genes would have it, I look either Irish or Mexican depending on the time of year. I just don't burn....if I do get a little "pink" it turns brown by the following day....right now, the only proof I have that I am indeed caucasion is the skin hiding under my watchband and a few other places... ;-) |
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Wow, I'm surprised at how harshly this idea is being judged. |
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sappho, lighten up, will ya? This is an IDEA, not a full-blown plan. If it inspires someone to create something like what I've laid out, I imagine they would be motivated to work out the kinks in it. |
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runforrestrun, just because you might not need such a product badly yourself, does that mean it won't help others? Also, I'm not a scientist, and as this is yet an imaginary product, I went all the way in imagining all kinds of benefits. |
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sappho, as for adding yet another laboratory-created chemical to add to our everyday products, yeah, I know it's not optimal, but your alternative, old-fashioned sunblock, is no better in that respect. Okay, so we wouldn't have to add the sunblock to every soap out there - people should have options, but I'd like to see something like this idea come to fruition. As it stands, the idea's benefits seem to greatly outweigh the negative consequences. |
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XSX, you've got a whole bun. That's not being judged harshly - you're doing well. |
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Sarenka, I am well aware that I'm not treating your idea lightly. I just would have liked to see more than the concept, which would save you from the indictment of m-f-d magic.
I still have to disagree with "the idea's benefits seem to greatly outweigh the negative consequences". This just doesn't follow, in my opinion. Blanketing all cosmetic products with an additive, the properties of which 99% of people won't understand, does not solve any problems other than immediate reaction to UV. When a large number of people blindly use something because they have been told it's good for them, without evidence which is easy to understand and stands up to questioning, many won't use it properly and many won't trust it.
So I return to the use of sunblock without reapplication. The 'factor' number on the creams we use now is a multiplication factor: how much more time you can spend out in the sun before you burn. If you are fair-skinned, you could burn after five minutes: use factor thirty and you can stay out 5*30 -> two and a half hours. Now, unless your magic ingredient is going to work in a fundamentally different way (shower gel moisturising agent which bonds fatter/darker melanins to every skin cell perhaps - don't complain I'm not trying to help you out here), you are stuck with this: these present sunscreens are diffusers, not blockers, and they don't prevent UV photons reacting with inadequately pigmented melanin in your skin. This is why you burn. So, if you want to stick to current formulations of sunscreen, your 24-hour UV-protection shower gel for a fairskinned person is going to have to be about factor 300. Next point is that the factoring scale is imperfect, it levels off at about 50 so your 300SPF isn't possible.
Please don't tell me to lighten up again, I have held my dark-eyed, dark-haired, olive-skinned friend's hand through painful radiography to eliminate a malignant mole, after one too many Mediterranean beach holidays. I don't find this a 'lightening-up' topic, I'm afraid. |
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//Also, I'm not a scientist, and as this is yet an imaginary product, I went all the way in imagining all kinds of benefits. // |
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I was trying to help you by suggesting that you needed to add more substance to prevent this from being "magic" or WIBNI and earning a [marked-for-deletion] tag. |
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Coming up with a list of benefits doesn't add to the product, just enhances it's WIBNI status.... |
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For example, I can decide that I want a "pill" that gives everyone exactly the amount of specific vitamins that they need everday (based on what they eat and drink) for a week through the use of time release technology.... I can then list a whole lot of benefits for such a pill. But, if I can't explain the technology of how it will *know* what that individual person needs....then, no matter what the benefits, it's still a WIBNI or magic pill. |
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sappho has done your work for you. You should have had a basic understanding of how sunblocks worked and what they contained.... |
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This raises a point I'm not clear about. Do you really have to know every detail of how something works before it stops being WIBNI/magic? If so, I would say that the idea is no longer a halfbaked one. I would personally say that, as long as it is feasible, it does not have to be explained. This requires common sense, of course. |
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Although sapho's comments are certainly helpful, they do not prevent the idea from being possible. Even given the basis of the factors, it's reasonable to propose the application of sunscreen via showering. It's also reasonable to suppose that it's possible to include some form of slow release. |
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Of course, elements of many ideas here are shown to be impossible, and this is obviously so with the factor 300 stuff. But the basic idea remains valid, and one that might help prevent the unfortunate set of events that Sappho's friend had to go through. |
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I fishboned this because it appears to rely on a magic ingredient: some form of sunblock that will offer automatic total waterproof protection for 24 hours. I agree such a thing would be nice, and I'm certain Nivea are desperately searching for it, but that's hardly an original idea, and without any idea of what it would contain, this idea is just vague speculation. |
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Therefore it comes down to the other novel part of the idea, whether applying sunblock in the shower is a good idea. I don't think all-over application via a shower is a particularly good way of applying sunblock, as it will be wasteful and hard to ensure full coverage (in contrast to deliberately rubbing it into exposed areas), and it will not allowing you to use different protection factors on different parts of your body. Spray-on sun creams and other technologies offer better solutions in my opinion. |
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You don't need to express every aspect of an idea, but I think an idea on the halfbakery should involve more innovation, be more useful or more fun. On the other hand, I don't think this idea falls entirely into the WIBNI/magic category, just into the underwhelming category. |
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I'll probably take flack for pooping the party, and maybe I'm just in a bad mood - but I can't see any part of this idea that isn't WIBNI, nor any reason why it shouldn't be [marked-for-deletion]. The idea seems to boil down to nothing more than "magic body wash/lotion magically stays on under all conditions and magically gives you perfect protection from UV." Why not come up with a lotion that also magically protects you from diseases, car accidents, pregnancy, and lawyers? |
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Let me take you back to the late 19th century. The infernal combustion engine has just been invented. I propose an idea in the halfbakers' journal (available at all good gentlemen's clubs in the major cities of the world) that a handsome cab (horse drawn) should be made to run autonomously. |
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I make little reference to the engine which powers it (it could be steam or the i.c.e.), and none to the complex gearing, crankshafts, steering mechanisms etc that would be needed to make it feasible. |
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Would my idea be magic or WIBNI? No. Because although I do not explain how exactly it is to work, although the technology does not yet exist to bake it (otherwise it would be baked, of course), it is a feasible idea, as the next hundred years will show. |
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I think that the same principles apply to this idea. There are many reasons to criticize, but not to m-f-d. As XSX says herself, this is an idea, not a full blown plan. |
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Sorry to go on, wanted to make a point about WIBNI-ism, and this just turned out to be the place to do it. |
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I feel like I've gotten the mfd prize for this one. Well, as Yamahito says, just because I don't know exactly how to formulate this idea doesn't mean it doesn't have some redeeming qualities. |
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Perhaps it is a bit of a wish, but I wanted to share my thought about using the combination of a long-lasting sunblock and body wash (or maybe even bubble bath?) to keep up with our species' ever-growing need for sun protection. If it causes someone who knows something about formulating these things to create something along these lines, I'd feel it worthwhile to have posted it here. |
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Thanks, everyone, for all of your comments and votes. Sappho, I meant no insult by my "lighten up" comment to you. Best wishes for your friend's recovery. |
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yama, I agree with your assessment, but I'd take the example one step further. To me, WIBNI means that the author is presenting an idea which is obviously impossible, at least from all appearances and within the bounds of existing technology, and makes no attempt to explain that. Examples: a gun that shoots rays that make people happy. A matter transporter to cut down the commute time in the morning. Stuff like that. |
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This isn't WIBNI at all. As Sarenka points out, materials get delivered to the skin via soap transport now, and have for a long time. Generally it's skin moisturizers or deodorants, and I don't think it's that much of a stretch to extend this to sunscreen. True, it may not work quite as it is described, but it *is* nonetheless described, so therefore this is not a WIBNI. |
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Sarenka, don't sweat it. There's no accounting for what gets the baked goods here sometime. I had an idea once (since deleted) for singing songs in third person past tense that ended up at #4 on the top ten list with almost a 100 votes. Go figure. |
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rfr... are you aware that in one of your annotations above, in discussing the m-f-d tag, you have actually marked this idea for deletion? |
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Body soap that contains sunscreen is available at www.flipsoap.com |
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//So, you admit this is "magic"....that generally earns a [m-f-d] tag around here....//
I agree with runforrestrun. [Marked For Deletion] |
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Before you mark ideas for deletion, perhaps you should learn how to do it properly. |
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Sappho, FLOURIDE is added to water to protect teeth. FLOURINE is a reactive lethal gas. |
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Madcat, you should work on your spelling before your nitpicking. In any case, water containing fluorides by definition contains fluorine. *Elemental* fluorine is a highly reactive gas. |
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The same idea just hit me. Love it! |
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Hello Folks, THIS PRODUCT EXISITS!!! |
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Its called KLEN
www.KLENSKIN.com |
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for a shill you certainly seem vague on the actual merits of your product. Sun screen is only effectively applied to the surfaces of your body exposed to the sun. Cancers that arise in the skin in non exposed parts of the body either moved there from sun exposed areas or were not caused by sun exposure. If
KLEINSKIN doesn't understand cancer how can it protect us from it? Does your product have independent laboratory confirmation that it actually delivers any UV protection when used as directed? Lets see some links here. |
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Please note the last post here before this activity was 2003. Thank you. |
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well if you go to the effort to shill your product on a 7 year old post then expect at least some resistance. It's an invasion of the community to start an account just to shill. SHAME, BAD, NEWBIE DOESN'T GET A BISCUIT. |
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[WcW] IIRC those "see-through" cameras are a result of a UV-shift: clothing doesn't necessarily block all UV, though the obvious solution to that is to either impregnate summer clothing at manufacture time (use a different dye perhaps) or administer a spray-on to the clothing before venturing outside... coating the skin seems pretty bass-ackwards. |
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[marked-for-deletion] [KLENSKIN] Account: could've provided a relevant link and an explanation (if not an industrial secret) of how it works; decided to spam instead. |
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//some scientific stuff but basically uses a positively charged silica gel ingredient that is naturally attracted to the negatively charged skin... This product just makes sense...// |
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No it doesn't. Applying this in the bath or shower would neutralize any static charge, rendering that explanation implausible. |
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From the website:
KLEN is the culmination of over 20 years of specialized research seeking to create a sunscreen that could be washed on and stay on the skin to protect it throughout the day. The breakthrough came from a multi-patented technology that is able to achieve a long-lasting shield by taking the sunscreen molecules, which are negatively charged, and scientifically converting them to become a positively charged molecule. The sunscreen molecules now have a natural affinity for our negatively charged skin, thus creating a magnetic attraction. |
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'Scientifically converting them'? I'm guessing this shit washes right off, and SPF 15 is probably the protection regular 'soap scum' residue provides, which is basically none at all. |
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//i just asked for a little open mindedness.// yeah you and the former minister of wealth of Nigeria who keeps e-mailing me. |
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We got open minds: some days you could swear the wind-section's bus exploded, how open they are. |
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On the other hand we ask that you read the FAQ's on how to post & annotate. |
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Sorry folks i saw a 7 year old post that pertained to
something i was doing... your not into it, okay. but my
name
is KRIS give a call to the company, i'm not hiding and i'm
not
a scammer. I believe in this product and the technology,
i'm
not a bad person just cause you can't believe it works. ask
any question on it and i'll give an honest answer. ie:
[RCARTY] A sunscreen with SPF 15 blocks close to 94% of
UVB radiation, while an SPF 30 will block around 97% of
UVB, SPF 50 blocks 99 %
kris@klenskin.com... done and done. |
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Geez, HB'ers, that was a harsh welcome to Kris of KLENSKIN. I'm actually interested in hearing from companies and individuals who have baked or even attempted to bake my halfbaked ideas. I have not concluded that this was pure spamming. |
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I posted a link to their product, for further evaluation. I have not decided for myself if it actually does what it claims to do, but I'd like to keep an open mind about it until then. |
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If anyone has tried this product, please let us all know how things went. If you're a scientist, likewise, let us know your opinion of the science behind this product. |
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Thank you for contacting me, Kris. |
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thanks. again the science part of this to appease you
technical guys is all at AQUEA SCIENTIFIC, our partner/ main
ingredient! (i deleted my earlier posts... this is all the info
needed to make a decision) |
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I'd be flattered if AQUASCIENTIFIC looked into some of my ideas, possibly offering something in the mid six figures. I wouldn't mind at all. However if they just want to tell me that they happen to have replicated the idea and would i not be so kind as to stop feigning a breech of their numerous patents then I'm not interested Thank-You-Very-Much (German translation please). |
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