h a l f b a k e r y"This may be bollocks, but it's lovely bollocks."
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Swords. They have cachet. Images of swords abound in
popular media. Real swords are always popular museum
pieces. Swords must have been pretty useful.
But I bet people dropped them all the time. People were
whacking things with them, waving them, falling down
and so on. Lots of opportunities
to drop the thing. But
never once have I seen a wrist loop on a sword.
If it were my lot to charge into battle with a sword, a loop
around my wrist would be very welcome. This is about the
most prosaic idea I have ever posted but I am curious
whether my fellow bakers know of the history of lack
thereof of the wrist loop on a sword.
Wikipedia: Lanyard
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lanyard
[rcarty, Aug 25 2014]
Sword knot . . .
http://en.m.wikiped...iki/Hilt#Sword_knot
. . . a lanyard looped around the hand to prevent the sword being lost if it is dropped. [baconbrain, Aug 25 2014]
The Black Knight
http://en.wikipedia...ight_(Monty_Python)
Sometimes, bravery isn't enough. [8th of 7, Aug 25 2014]
[link]
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I think I have seen wrist loops, a few times. Cavalry sabers would be
a good place for them, but I only see one with a strap in Google, and I
dunno if it is for the wrist. |
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I fitted a tomahawk with a loop like
what used to be on cross-country ski poles. It's a flat strap that is
doubled over, with the two ends fastened above the handgrip. I have
to put my hand up through it, so
that part is between my palm and the grip, and the loop of it holds my
wrist. It holds so well that I don't really
need to grasp the handle tightly
anymore. I haven't tried it on a sword. |
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Sorry [bungston] not new, your guess is right, I'm sure the idea was baked centuries ago. |
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Most usually for mounted fighters who would have most difficulty recovering a dropped weapon from a galloping horse I believe. |
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[8th] will probably know more / for sure, he likes weapons? |
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Wrist loops are sometimes used on cavalry
sabres because they don't have a sharp edge.
They are heavy and blunt and inflict injuries
by crushing, not cutting. A sharp sabre may
cut
into bone and then stick; the rider then has
to let go of the weapon, or get pulled off the
horse. |
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If the sword is knocked from the user's grasp
during a blow or parry, it could pivot round
and do a lot of damage. |
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// If the sword is knocked from the user's grasp during a blow or parry, it could pivot round and do a lot of damage. // |
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Is this the origin of the expression "double-edged sword"? |
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//it could pivot round and do a lot of damage. |
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Reminds me of Sturton's unfortunate decision to try pruning with a sabre at his sea lily farm. The sabre slipped out of his hand and dealt a wild blow to his...err, well to put it bluntly....crinoids. They were never quite the same again, poor chap*. |
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Of course the Möbius sabre is in itself a loop, so one isn't required. Don't get me started on the klein bottle sabre.. |
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*Oddly enough, this was only a month after that Highlands hillwalking accident, where he had to helicoptered off due to a strain injury he sustained in the Trossachs. Some say bagpiping may have played some part of it. |
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Ah yes Sturton, years since I've seen the old fart, I really should try to keep up with people more, how is his aquarium supply business doing these days & does he still enjoy hill walking as he used to? |
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I fear not, getting a strain in the Trossachs is not to be taken lightly. |
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Ironically the piper was the first person to be convicted of "playing bagpipes without due care and attention*", and got 4 points on his artistic licence. |
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*in this case it was practicing "Stairway to Heaven" and getting the same wrong note every time. |
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Swords were INCREDIBLY expensive. Worn as
conspicuous symbols of wealth power and menace,
having a loop attaching your favoured hand to your
scabbard-ed sword on the opposite side of your
body would be stupid. |
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I've seen a few demonstrations of what we think
was the reality of sword fights. It's pretty dynamic
and non movie-like stuff. From what I remember,
there were a whole collection of attack and
defense moves that flow continuously from
drawing the sword to inserting it into someone.
Changing hands to suit the situation was common.
A sword's expense means all of that edge to edge
stuff is right out. |
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Also, the fact that swords, in some form, have
been around for 3000 years across pretty much
every metal-working civilization and no one has
adopted a lanyard-type attachment, leads me to
think it's a not an advantageous thing. |
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// It's pretty dynamic and non movie-like stuff. // |
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Correct. Real sword-fighting is quite unlike stage fighting, or
competitive fighting (Sabre, foil, rapier, epee) |
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// From what I remember, there were a whole collection of attack and
defense moves that flow continuously from drawing the sword to
inserting it into someone. // |
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That depends totally on the weapon which can range from a double-
handed double edged sword like the Claymore, to the single-edged
Katana, or the pointed Rapier. Some swords are for slashing, some for
stabbing, some more like a sort of club .. |
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// Changing hands to suit the situation was common. // |
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Whatever suits ... sword plus shield (or buckler), sword plus dagger, or
sword plus axe/mace/club depending on personal preference. From
the end of Roman legions until the 17th century, very few soldiers
were uniformly armed and equipped, except for ceremonial purposes.
Into the 20th century, during both world wars, many combatants had a
"weapon of choice", modifying standard weapons or adopting enemy
ones. Officers chose and paid for their own sidearms, the condition
being that the ammunition should be a standard service calibre. |
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// A sword's expense means all of that edge to edge stuff is right out.
// |
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Er, no. In a real fight, the objective is to disable the opponent to the
point where they no longer present an immediate threat. Everything
else is secondary. A combatant with an expensive sword who worries
about a notched blade is at a disadvantage to an opponent with a
cheap sword who isn't afraid to damage it. |
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However "valuable", other swords can be made, bought, or stolen. On
the other hand, damaged or missing body parts can present more of a
problem, even if you're The Black Knight <link> |
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//Sturton...how is his aquarium supply business doing
these days & does he still enjoy hill walking as he used
to?// |
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The aquarium supply business was the Intercalary's, not
Sturton's. Indeed, it was something of a sore point
between them because Sturton considered it a personal
challenge to create a new recipe for each species. His
Discus aux Fines Herbes was, I have to say, something a
triumph. It all went downhill after he tried to use an
electric eel to cook his Angelfish Cake. |
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As for hill walking, well, we own so few decent hills
these days that the fun has rather gone out of it. |
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Don't the hills you have left still need to be walked twice a day? |
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Yes, but they have people to do that for them, of course. |
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They have people who poop for the hills? |
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