h a l f b a k e r yBunned. James Bunned.
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The US military has, on a number of occasions, created
complexity by seeking simplicity in their logistics train.
One such example was to choose a fuel and vehicles such
that everything could be run on a single fuel variety. To
these ends, the military noticed how similar diesel and
jet
fuel
were, and set about converting everything to run on
a
common derivative. This concept is tempting, with lots
and
lots of one type of fuel, your advance into enemy
territory
will not be halted because no one predicted how much
use
the tactical hedge trimmer* would get. Predictably, it
turns out half the ground vehicles have fuel pumps that
don't agree with the lubricating properties of jet fuel, so
we have a nice example of simplicity-induced-
complexity**. So the single fuel probably needs better
lubricating properties. It missed a big area too... all the
people.
In order to prosecute a war, you still*** need actual
people, and they need all sorts of complex things. You
can
eliminate some, like sleep, with some modafinil and a
few
amphetamines but a fuel source is still needed.
Irritatingly, people can't metabolize diesel so the US
military chose to produce MRE which taste the same but
are much less convenient. Now, people can metabolize
fatty acids, and you CAN run engines on those. They are
unstable however, and go all rancid, smelly and
oxidized,
which is not helpful. You can stabilize such fatty acids
with
a methyl or ethyl group, then they're great fuel for
engines. People consuming methyl esters have problems
with disagreeable concentrations of methanol, and ethyl
esters (Fatty acid ethyl esters) tend to cause pancreatitis
at
tiny concentrations****. So there are problems there.
Fatty
acids are metabolized quite nicely into ketone bodies by
the liver, and many tissues find these excellent fuel. The
brain is fussy and needs glucose, and even the infantry
need some brain activity. The liver can't make glucose
from fatty acids*****.
Damn. But wait, It CAN make it from glycerol!! Where
do
you find that? well, in fat you have 3 fatty acid chains
attached to a glycerol, a tryglyceride. So just use fat?
No,
that solidifies in fuel tanks when its cold, and the fatty-
acid glycerol ratio is all wrong to solve the glucose
problem.
So, my solution: glycerol with one fatty acid attached.
It's
perfect. Three times the glycerol to fatty acid molar
ratio,
which solves the glucose generation problem, the
melting
point is fine if you use a short chain fatty acid. They
taste
a bit sweet, they have lovely lubrication properties, even
"personal" lubrication properties if you add a little water,
you know, for battlefield chafing. You can run diesel
engines on straight glycerol, or fat, so no reason why this
wont work there. If the soldiers get hungry, wheel in the
fuel truck. Done. I'll take my DOD contract now please.
*a diesel hedge trimmer is no more ridiculous than a
diesel
dirt bike, and the USMC has plenty of those.
**relevant XKCD <link>
***true, as of Late 2015
****people with pancreatitis tend to be ineffective at war
fighting.
*****actually, it can, well, about 10% of that required,
via
acetone and acetol monoxygenase pathway, but that's
secret not-in-Stryer knowledge only known to the
insiders...
Simplifying Industry Standards
https://xkcd.com/927/
[bs0u0155, Dec 09 2015]
[link]
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// even the infantry need some brain activity. // |
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Only for enlisted soldiers and non-comissioned officers. Historically and observationally, brain activity in comissioned officers represents such an overwhelming barrier to promotion that it is never detectable above the rank of Captain. |
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I read about these Welsh folks who were circumventing the fuel tax by purchasing tubs of canola oil (was it canola?) and using it for diesel. If "biodiesel" can be a food grade edible oil why not just use that? |
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I used to put vegetable oil in my old Renault Clio diesel,
back in my undergraduate days, its an easy decision when
the worst case scenario is to destroy a fuel pump, which
costs less than a tank of real diesel. Used to get it from a
pub, neutralize it, filter it, good to go. Anyhow, if you feed
people on straight fat, they will be fine for a while, but
gluconeogenesis will slowly strip their muscles of amino
acids to maintain blood sugar. If you feed people on a
mixture of fat and glycerol, they don't need to strip their
muscles. |
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This is very probably one of the best proposals for a
combined military food/fuel that I've ever
encountered on this site today, so far. |
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It's early in the day, but yea. Very clever. [+] |
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I for one would be pretty intimidated by a military
that all ran on the same stuff. |
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"Today we go into battle! Our tanks, jet bombers and
soldiers all drink War Juice, we kill
many enemy! Let enemy girly men bitches eat ice
cream and lollypops like
cry baby pussies!" |
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I would picture such an army being very no nonsense
and never using contractions when they speak. |
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Hear hear! Contractions aren't big, and they're not
clever. |
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/ If you feed people on a mixture of fat and glycerol, they don't need to strip their muscles./ |
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Muscle stripping will occur to allow gluconeogenesis but also for lack of essential amino acids. Even yeast which can make all their own AA cannot get by on straight glycerol because there is no nitrogen source. To prevent muscle loss one would need to supply the humans their essential AA to support protein synthesis. |
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If you want a clean, purist, no carb ketogenic fighting force you could supply extra glutamate in their AA bar which (if memory serves - glutamate to alpha ketoglutarate?) is the AA needed for gluconeogenesis. |
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+ for rational, thinkable, concept driven scheme. |
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//Hear hear! Contractions aren't big, and they're not
clever.// |
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That's right. You'll never see a buff, heavily armed
alien space soldier using them. They're, a sign of
weakness! It paints a picture of a young warrior who
was wasting his time studying writing skills rather
than battle tactics. |
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I use them 'cause they save a little time. And I'm not
a heavily armed alien warrior, there's that. Resonably
buff, but not the other stuff. |
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I like for instance how Romulans and Klingons figured
out how to travel faster than the speed of light but
never learned how to say "We're traveling at warp
factor two captain!" |
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Fun fact: The spell check for Halfbakery recognized
Klingons as a legitimate word without suggesting it's
misspelled but not Romulans. Interesting. Try it. It
also doesn't recognize Halfbakery. |
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Not only that, but it doesn't recognize "recognize". |
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Minor challenge: create a readable sentence none of
whose words are recognized by the HB spell-checker.
Accepted spelling variants may be used. |
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Azerbaijanians shewed Uzbekistanis anguilliform
draff. |
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Doctorremulac3's Romulan Halfbakery. |
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It's a sentence. What do I win? |
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I think you'll find it's a clause rather than a sentence. |
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I'm not sure it's even that. I think it's just a title no? |
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A clause is a group of words that can act as a
sentence, but is not necessarily a complete sentence
on its own. All clauses contain both a subject and a
predicate, which always contains a verb. A predicate
tells something about what the subject is doing.
Some clauses can stand alone as a complete
sentence; others cannot. |
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I wrote that from memory of course, I didn't cut and
past it from the web. Well, maybe a little bit. |
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//The spell check// is a browser thing for text boxes. |
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// I think you'll find it's a clause rather than a sentence. // |
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<obligatory Marx Bros 'sanity clause' reference /> |
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//Muscle stripping will occur to allow gluconeogenesis
but also for lack of essential amino acids. // |
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Agreed, you need amino acids to build proteins. But you
can go for a long time without them, cells recycle
proteins, and the whole body recycles them, layers of
nested protein recycling efficiency, you're going to be
needing a few grams to keep up with that. The difference
is when you need to use them for energy.
Gluconeogenesis needs to make 100-ish grams of glucose
per day, so it's got to take roughly the same amount of
protein from somewhere. You get into pretty serious
problems if you're loosing 100s of grams a day, which
would be enhanced should there be any physical exertion
going on. There is frequently exertion in war. |
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Seriously, this would be an amazing concept for how a
fictional science fiction army fuels itself. I love so called
"hard science fiction" where there's some real theory
behind the technology featured and this is right there.
Interesting from a scientific and novelty basis. |
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I'm betting with a little work you could get it featured in
a movie. It would be an interesting scene and a cool
feature of the characters. Just have one scene where the
alien army general talks about how they all drink "War
Juice." |
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Again, for psychological reasons alone, a military force
that all eats the same stuff, man and machine?
Intimidating. The next Mad Max movie is a candidate if
they make another one. Last one was lousy. |
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// a military force that all eats the same stuff, man and machine // |
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"He's more machine now than man, twisted and evil ... " |
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You got something against man-machine hybrids ? Eh ? EH ? You talkin' to us ? You talkin' to us ? You talkin' to us ? Then who the hell else are you talking... you talking to us ? Well, we're the only ones here ..." |
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Settle down 8, here, have some war juice. |
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Oohh! Good name for a 180 proof moonshine. |
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Licencing terms negotiable. |
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//Eh ? EH ? You talkin' to us ? You talkin' to us ? You talkin' to
us ? // |
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Looks like the collective is getting a little wound up and
cranky... could be low blood sugar, check the fatty acid-
glycerol ratio in your Borg-spec War Juice. If it's off, I'll ship
out a new batch gratis. The cosmos does not need a cranky
collective. |
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Is there a better category choice, or does the nature of the idea best suit it for this one ? Talk amongst yourselves, extra points for interpretive dance and body casting. |
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Why are all military vehicles not equipped with a clockwork
motor at least as a backup? Winding up these motors would
double up as excercise and the large key needed would
naturally fit all vehicles. |
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/The difference is when you need to use them for energy/ |
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If they are scarce you can save them. This is where the very cool ketogenic switch comes in. |
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If carbohydrate is scarce the body can switch over to burn ketone bodies for energy. If this was covered in biochem I was asleep, but the existence of an alternate fuel metabolism is a very cool thing. Circulating ketone bodies (actually acetone) serves to signal far-flung cells that there is glucose scarcity and they switch; even the brain. During ketogenesis glucose is reserved for synthetic needs, not energy production. |
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Ahhh, Soylent Green Unleaded ... |
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//Circulating ketone bodies (actually acetone) serves to
signal far-flung cells that there is glucose scarcity and
they switch; even the brain. During ketogenesis glucose is
reserved for synthetic needs, not energy production// |
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You're half right, which is the dangerous amount of right.
There's a bunch of different ketone bodies, which is why
they're termed ketone bodies, not just acetone. And they
do do signalling stuff which is great. There's also a major
role for the absence of signalling, glucose, insulin and my
personal favorite: circulating reabsorbed bile derivatives,
there's not enough love for the bile acid receptor in my
opinion. Anyhow, eventually the body can converts to
ketone bodies, even the brain can get 75% there. There's
still that 25%, and worse, red blood cells are useless at
running without glucose. At rest you can cope, lots of
sitting around limp is advantageous here. Now, inject a
bit of stress, suddenly the muscles start chomping on the
glucose again. Following that, the whole body is going to
have some redox-based housekeeping to do, the only way
to reset oxidized glutathione requires glucose, and the
ketone body to glucose conversion doesn't happen, much,
maybe. |
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