h a l f b a k e r y"Put it on a plate, son. You'll enjoy it more."
add, search, annotate, link, view, overview, recent, by name, random
news, help, about, links, report a problem
browse anonymously,
or get an account
and write.
register,
|
|
|
Please log in.
Before you can vote, you need to register.
Please log in or create an account.
|
The big freeze is a potential scenario for the end of the universe. Indeed, it is one of the more hearled points of view amongst cosmologists today (needs reference). In this theory, matter diffuses throughout the known universe ever reaching a less interactive (very cold) state. The temperature of the
universe reaches a minimum.
The idea: Entropy is always maximized in a closed system tending towards equilibrium, right? The big freeze would be a very low entropic state (perfectly ordered), and thus will never happen due to the second law of thermodynamics.
Heat death vs. the big freeze
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_death
[ldischler, Feb 18 2007]
[link]
|
| |
I think the cosmologists took entropy into account when pondering the 'big freeze'. |
|
| |
It will only be very cold locally; 'globally' speaking energy will be conserved and entropy will have increased. |
|
| |
There's a semantic problem here. Once the universe reaches total uniformity, as in the big freeze, it will be in a state of perfect equilibrium--no part will be different from any other part, so no part will have any reason to change its state. Thus, entropy is in fact maximized. |
|
| |
[marked-for-deletion...nah] Wikipedia has an article on this, but it's a theory, not a bakery idea. |
|
| |
//It will only be very cold locally; 'globally' speaking energy will be conserved and entropy will have increased.// |
|
| |
See, this is what I don't understand. I see the big freeze bieng very cold through and through. |
|
| |
Really, I just highly doubt the universe would let itself go like this. Put up a fight, universe! Do some crunches, get in shape! |
|
| |
//I see the big freeze bieng very cold
through and through// |
|
| |
The point is that heat is very similar to
marmalade. Temperature, on the other
hand, is formally equivalent to
"marmaladiness". And, naturally, the
universe is equivalent to a slice of
wheatgerm crusty bread which, in an
un-breadlike way, is expanding. Hence,
although the total amount of
marmalade in the universe remains
constant, the marmalidiness of the
universe will decrease. I think that will
clarify matters for you. |
|
| |
That makes perfect sense [MB]. Thanks, I shall remember that!.
What [5th Earth] said.. The semantic problem is that 'perfectly ordered' does not necessarily mean 'Low Entropy'.
I suspect that the idea is that 'perfectly homogenised' = High Entropy.
Throw a jar of marmalade in the air and see what happens. |
|
| |
Entropy is a direct measure of the order in a system. I don't understand it otherwise. |
|
| |
[MaxB]: That is superb. I only wish that my 6th year Chem & Physics teachers had used breakfast items to describe the universe - I'd have understood immediately. |
|
| |
Electron spin is like Lucky Charms... |
|
| |
[Jinbish] Many thanks. There is in fact a
1:1 correspondence between breakfast
foods and physical phenomena, a property
known as "Supercomestibility". |
|
| |
Few people appreciate, for example, that
the entire "dark matter/dark energy" issue
can be resolved by reference to black
pudding, where the relevant equations
have already been set up and, for the most
part, solved. |
|
| |
Quite right!. We are all aware that there is much more Black Pudding in the Universe than White Pudding. |
|
| |
... and what about haggis or <feels sick> fruit pudding? |
|
| |
[MaxB] ...if the little wheatgermy bits in the slice of bread represent galaxies, we can see that as the slice of bread expands uniformly, the space between each galaxy and the others increases and, from the point of view of any galaxy all the others appear to be receding from it (as first noted by Hubble, I think). Also, I can't help noting that the universe's background radiation is not evently distributed but rather is 'lumpy', like a chunky marmalade. |
|
| |
I've removed my MFD, for it would be a shame to lose Maxwell's concepts of "marmaladiness" (ie, jamminess) and "supercomestibility" (which, when they become widely accepted, will surely end physics as we know it). |
|
| |
[Ian]: You've just put yourself in prime position for "Pun of the Month". |
|
| |
Thanks to all for the ever ingenious interpretations. The universe will never bear the same mysterious nature. Thanks-a-lot. |
|
| |
// the universe's background radiation
is not evently distributed but rather is
'lumpy', like a chunky marmalade//
Quite so, and well observed. You will
also note that the lumps themselves
tend (depending on the gravitational
constant - which is of course directly
analogous to the pressure applied to
the spreading-knife) to aggregate
towards the edges of the bread.
Cosmologically, this leads to an
apparent over-concentration of the
density of galaxies close to the event
horizon (or "crust" as it is known), and
hence confound any calculations that
depend on a cosmological constant. A
failure to grasp this obvious point has
lead Hawking quite far astray, I fear. |
|
| |
//this leads to an apparent over-concentration of the density of galaxies close to the event horizon (or "crust" as it is known)// A clarification if you will - what is the shape of the universe? If it is like a slice of bread (as this anno suggests) does that mean there is a big doughy empty bit in the middle with hardly any marmalade? Could it be that the cosmic butter knife isn't long enough to reach into the middle? |
|
| |
Also, I'm extremely intrigued that matter and energy form at the 'edges' of spacetime (if I may paraphrase further) and that the gravitational constant might somehow be describing the consistency of the bread at any given location - even more so that we might be inhabiting an extra crunchy (and ever expanding?) crust-like area, in an ever leavening shock wave of existence, perhaps. |
|
| |
That's just how God likes his breakfast, methinks. |
|
| |
Or perhaps we could figure out how to create minature big bangs in a laboratory setting. You know, find a way to create the uncreatable, that is, find a way to create energy from nothing. |
|
| |
// what is the shape of the universe? If
it is like a slice of bread (as this anno
suggests) does that mean there is a big
doughy empty bit in the middle with
hardly any marmalade// The pattern of
cosmic background radiation suggests
that the universe is, probably, a
hyperbagel (ie, essentially a 4-D torus).
This makes the question of "what is in
the middle" very difficult to answer,
since the middle of the universe is, in
fact, outside the universe. |
|
| |
I suspect that the entire comestible/
cosmology analogy may have reached
its limits. |
|
| |
unless you are prepared to contemplate that most cosmic of dishes: The paella. |
|
| |
Yeah. I'm pretty sure we can string out the theory a bit more by using noodles. |
|
| |
"Mmmmm - hyperbagel" <drools> |
|
| |
And let's not forget porridge. |
|
| |
I assume in the [MaxwellB] model of the universe, the marmaladed bread is stuck to the back of a huge cat? |
|
| |
[hippo] If you're not going to take this
seriously..... |
|
| |