h a l f b a k e r yTip your server.
add, search, annotate, link, view, overview, recent, by name, random
news, help, about, links, report a problem
browse anonymously,
or get an account
and write.
register,
|
|
|
Deuterated insulin
Deuterium is less than a quarter a gram deuterated insulin is likely to have last much longer from the isotope effect | |
Deuterium is less than a quarter a gram deuterated insulin is likely to have last much longer from the isotope effect
fully deuterating 20 milligrams of insulin which would be a bunch as its a medically active peptide would cost less than half a ¢
modern insulins are produced via genetically
engineered cultured material solitary microorganisms have been bred to survive an all deuterium culture fluid Thus breeding a current insulin producing organism to survive a deuterium environment is likely
wikipedia says words rather like The rate of a reaction involving a C-H group is typically 6 to 10 times faster than the corresponding C-D group
the deuterated version lasts longer plus resists degradation maybe creating an oral insulin with GI tract region carrying polymers
as a multiunit peptide there is also the opportunity to deuterate just part of the structure
anyway I think it would make it have different pharmacodynamics which could be worth the deuterium at less than part of a ¢
Note I just read a review article that said a thing rather like there was a 1993 patent on using deuterium isotope effect with drugs I thought what about peptides they may resist degradation or become more orally available (there are orally available peptides this could make them an order of magnitude stronger perhaps even an oral insulin)
deuterated peptide antibiotic
http://www.google.c...=onepage&q=&f=false
different than insulin [beanangel, Oct 12 2009]
review article on pharmacologic deuterium
http://www.ncbi.nlm...nel.Pubmed_RVDocSum
[beanangel, Oct 12 2009]
C/D/N ISOTOPES
https://www.cdnisot...uKz3HHdMuDrGK1dLWwj
"The World's Most Extensive Supply of Deuterated Compounds" [ldischler, Oct 14 2009]
Article about Deuterated drugs
http://pipeline.cor...s_heavy_profits.php
[goldbb, Oct 15 2009]
Kinetic Isotope Effect (Wikipedia)
http://en.wikipedia...etic_isotope_effect
[Wily Peyote, Oct 15 2009]
Please log in.
If you're not logged in,
you can see what this page
looks like, but you will
not be able to add anything.
Annotation:
|
| |
//The rate of a reaction involving a C-H group is typically 6 to 10 times faster than the corresponding C-D group// |
|
| |
So your deuterated insulin will take part in 6 to 10 times fewer chemical reactions and thus be 6 to 10 times less effective than the real stuff? |
|
| |
I'm not sure it works that way, Wrongfellow. Isn't it the shape of a hormone that determines its activity? |
|
| |
Not a bad idea, but I have a few queries: |
|
| |
1) 6-10fold sounds like a lot |
|
| |
2) What about hydrogen exchange? Wouldn't that nullify
the deuteration? |
|
| |
3) Are reactions involving X-H bonds in insulin the main
method of its breakdown? I suspect not |
|
| |
4) I'm not sure about the economics here. making
deuterated insulin is not just a case of taking regular
insulin and mixing it with deuterium. I suspect it would be
horrendously expensive. |
|
| |
But still an interesting idea, and even understandable! + |
|
| |
That comment was meant to be slightly sarcastic - since I'm not sure it works that way either! I'm sure there's a lot more to insulin than its carbon-hydrogen bonds, and it seems a bit premature to me to extrapolate the 6-10x figure from a single C-H bond to an entire biomolecule. |
|
| |
One would predict that an all deuterated hydrocarbon would burn 6-10x more slowly than the hydrogenated counterpart. This would be testable. |
|
| |
I suspect insulin is inactivated with a single catalyzed cleavage of component amino acids. |
|
| |
Wait wait: here it is!
An open glass tube full of hydrogen lit with a splint sounds a tone. Doping the hydrogen with oxygen should facilitate the reaction and I assert that the faster burn will produce a different tone. Methane should produce still another tone. From my armchair, I recommend double checking this tone principle with oxygen and methane before burning costly deuterium. |
|
| |
I here assert that the tone produced by oxidizing gas in a glass tube varies with the rate of combustion. Thus pure deuterium should produce a different tone than pure hydrogen when burned in the same tube. |
|
| |
The abstract of the review cited by Beany contains perhaps
one of my favourite and under-used phrases in scientific
literature: " its biological effects have been extensively,
although seldom deeply, studied." |
|
| |
This is a fascinating idea, but I still have some questions. |
|
| |
• [beanangel], would you post a link to the wikipedia article(s) claiming C-D is 6-10x slower reacting than C-H? |
|
| |
• Isn't the number one cause of insulin breakdown simple hydrolysis of the protein into it's constituent amino acids? (That's C-C bond cleavage.) |
|
| |
• Isn't the "main threat" to insulin in the human body, not molecular breakdown, but return to it's inactive hexamer state via the liver for storage? (The material and energy economy of the human organism is staggering.) |
|
| |
• Would tritium, although mildly radioactive, be even more efficacious in some medicines than deuterium or simple protium (H)? |
|
| |
This is a nifty idea, though, and I like [bungston]'s ideas for testing the speed of reactions. Especially, because the most detrimental reactions to C-H, and presumably also C-D bonds, are oxidation (and halogenation). |
|
| |
Sigh. Humbled by my ignorance once more. Thank you all for the learning opportunity! |
|
| |
//effects have been extensively, although seldom deeply, studied// |
|
| |