Announce a program to occasionally fly a jet at high altitude and spray crap into the exhaust stream to shut the chemtrail nut-jobs up.
"Ok, we're doing it, happy? Now shut up about it." Leave them no place to go.
"Excuse me, would you like read this handout on the government chemtrail conspiracy?"
"You mean the one the President announced last week? Why is that news?"
Make it clear that the government decided to do it after getting the idea from the conspiracy nuts.
"We're not sure if it will stop global warming, increase global warming, control people's minds or what so we decided just to try it out and see what happens. I think this week we're trying peanut butter. Next week it's baby laxative. We'll get back to you with the results."-- doctorremulac3, May 19 2014 Yup. The morons are on the march. http://en.wikipedia...l_conspiracy_theoryAnd their votes are worth just as much as yours. [doctorremulac3, May 19 2014] Tin Foil Hat Amplifier http://web.archive.....edu/rahimi/helmet/ [bs0u0155, May 19 2014] Fashionable tinfoil hat https://www.dropbox...W-Wp0L6eTvsOvUZP0ZaStylish mind control protection [doctorremulac3, May 19 2014] Wait just a dern minute. You added a link to the San Francisco half -con A_20Baker_27s_20Day...n_20San_20FranciscoI think there is some sort of conspiracy theory operating here. [blissmiss, May 22 2014] Project Aurora http://en.wikipedia...rora_%28aircraft%29Interesting stuff. Looks like maybe pre-development for the latest generation long-dwell orbiter they're playing with now. [normzone, May 22 2014] bone from a conspiracy nut.-- xandram, May 19 2014 This idea verges on brilliance, though I'm not side which side it's verging from.
The strategy lends itself to many applications. Get a trained taxidermist to assemble the Area 52 alien corpse, and have the government announce that it's definitely, really an alien. Get the CIA to announce that they shot JFK and/or JR. Get NASA to announce that it faked the moon landings.
Within weeks of these announcements, the original conspiracy theorists will have deflated, and new conspiracy theorists will be arguing vehemently that the alien is a fake and the moon landings were real.-- MaxwellBuchanan, May 19 2014 //conspiracy theorists will be arguing vehemently that the alien is a fake and the moon landings were real//
Oooh. That's very Judo. Subvert them for your own purposes. Arguably, this is already done, by encouraging the worst of their excesses, thus marginalising them. That said, I'm all for the mockery of crazies.-- Custardguts, May 19 2014 anyone remember this? <link>-- bs0u0155, May 19 2014 A nice twist on this idea was conducted by BC authorities in Vancouver in 1992 after Asian Gypsy Moths were discovered on a Russian ship in the harbour. They decided to aerial spray 20,000 hectares of urban area with a microbe which attacks the moth. After several weeks of 'practice runs' with just water the big day came when they sprayed with the actual microbes.
Authorities logged hundreds of calls from people reporting sore throats, nausea, headaches and so on. After duly recording the complainants names and details they revealed that they'd actually decided to just do another practice run with only water and the real spraying had been put off a few weeks. After another while went by, they said that in reality, the real spraying took place during one of the earliest practice runs.
Brilliant. All those type of people who'd normally convince themselves that they'd suffer deleterious effects had already identified themselves during the water spraying session.-- AusCan531, May 19 2014 I'm a big fan of outsmarting the dummies like that. Thing is, you've got to stick with it. The dummies are patient, relentless and there are a lot of them.-- doctorremulac3, May 19 2014 [AusCan] That's fantastic!
This idea, though would inflate the conspiracy (esp long term), as it would act as extra chum in the water. Partial evidence is the attractor after all.
That said, there are real conspiracies (lobbyists esp.) active & powerful in the world today.
The best way the powerful have found to deflate conspiracy theorists, is to feed them false info (partial, again, to make it tasty), to drive them further from reality.-- sophocles, May 19 2014 LOL. In reading up on this sort of thing discovered the word "Conspiratards". Seems like I'm not the only one frustrated by people who treat science like just another point of view.-- doctorremulac3, May 19 2014 I don't know what is so brilliant about what they already do. One cannot believe either side, the nuts or the nuts are your only choices.-- xandram, May 20 2014 Ahh, but that's just what "THEY" want you to think ...
// The dummies are patient, relentless and there are a lot of them. //
... particularly here, it seems.-- 8th of 7, May 20 2014 Well then who f--k is "THEY"?-- xandram, May 20 2014 Xan, let me try to sway you.
Just the other day I was having a marvelous run along the beautiful San Francisco waterfront. As an excuse to stop torturing my body and to stop running, I stopped to talk to a group of people handing out flyers on the subject of chemtrails. The main guy was a very nice fellow, didn't have a cuckoo bird popping out of his forehead or anything.
So rather than trying to dissuade him from his belief by critiquing the science, I tried logic and I think I might have made some headway.
First I said, this is an exceptional claim, and it requires exceptional proof. Since we have none, let's try another approach. Let's look at probability.
Can we agree that innocent condensation trails have been around since aircraft were able to fly 30,000' or so? We see videos of B-17s in WW2 leaving the sky criss-crossed with these things. Right? "Right." Ok, so we've established that there are added chemical free con-trails. When did somebody start putting chemicals into these in your opinion? "About 15 years ago." Ok, who did this? "The government and Ratheon". Ok, so the democratically elected government in league with a publicly traded company.
Fine, so let's look at what would have to happen here. We know they'd have to think what they were doing is bad by virtue of the fact that they're keeping it a secret right? So if I were the president of Ratheon, I'd have to come to the board and say "Gentlemen, I propose that we all risk our wealth, the company's future, our very freedom since we might all go to prison to engage in a science experiment wherein we secretly do something that might have some effect. Our allies in the government have also decided to risk their careers to engage in this experiment. It will cost a lot of money, risk our company, our reputations and freedom since we might get thrown in jail, but the payoff is it will possibly have some outcome like changing the weather for better or worse, or end life on Earth, or wreck this group of people. Who's in?"
The risk to reward ratio is not one that any human being would engage in. There's nothing in it for anybody to do this.
Also, you give government WAYYY too much credit for being motivated and clever. They're neither. Government and corporate types want to come in, get as much out of the deal for as little effort and risk as possible. Ruining the planet with a secret program where there is no financial payoff is not something that corrupt people do. Corrupt people do things to benefit themselves.
The way corrupt governments make money is with bullshit promises to do something wonderful that will cost a lot of money. That's the standard government scam. It's worked for a long time so why fix it? Now if somebody came out and said "I propose a massive tax hike to pay for spraying stuff in the sky that will make hamsters behave." THAT would be something the government would do. Then they could get some corporate types to create "Hamster-be-good" aerial mood modifier, everybody takes home sacks of taxpayer money, the crap doesn't work and everybody who counts is happy.
I finished with saying there was plenty of government corruption out there without having to make up boogie man stories and that silly accusations can actually bolster government and corporate corruption by discrediting criticism. Often when a government entity gets caught doing something bad, they inevitably respond to these "Crazy, nut job conspiracy allegations."
Anyway, in closing, there's nothing in it for the bad guys, it's not worth the risk and therefore makes no sense.
I shook his hand and went on my way, I think I might have gotten through, maybe not. At least I got a rest from that horrible tortuous running I was doing.-- doctorremulac3, May 20 2014 Yeah, making running popular is a massive conspiracy by Nike (to sell shoes) and the Government (to make you die of a heart attack and thus save healthcare and social security costs). Well done though for trying to engage with and persuade the chemtrail conspiracy loon.I'm not really in favour though of legitimising chemtrails like the idea says. I think the chemtrail conspiracy loons would just take this as a victory and move on to complaining about how mobile phones cause cancer and childhood immunisations cause autism.-- hippo, May 20 2014 Yea, probably. And as far as changing minds, like I said, I stopped to engage in this exercise in futility as an excuse to stop running.
Because as Bill Murray said, "Exercise is the most horrible thing you can do." That' my mantra when I run. "This hurts, I feel bad, this is horrible, I hate exercise. This hurts, I feel bad, this is horrible, I hate exercise... hey, I better stop and talk to this crazy person!"-- doctorremulac3, May 20 2014 That's true (about exercising) - I live in a big city, where I frequently see people running in the parks and on the streets, and none of them ever look like they're enjoying themselves.-- hippo, May 20 2014 Yup, exercise sucks. I only do it so I don't end up getting buried in a piano case.
Hey Xan, can I suggest a great book by a guy who's a hell of a lot smarter than I am? It's called "Physics For Future Presidents" and it covers a range of topics in the news that need a little scientific explanation. It's written in plain English so clear and un-buzzword laden that even I could understand it. I'm afraid scientific types sometimes look down on laymen and don't really care if they understand what's going on. This guy is a great communicator and it's a very interesting read. Not a lot of boring numbers and scientific jargon. He just clarifies the science behind a lot of the stuff going on in the news these days.
I'd suggest it for anybody, even those with their own physics or other degree in the sciences. It's an easy read despite having the word "Physics" in the title.-- doctorremulac3, May 20 2014 //I frequently see people running in the parks and on the streets, and none of them ever look like they're enjoying themselves//
The morbidity of running is absolutely terrifying, up to 85% per runner per year. As a "health" intervention that's up there with blood letting.
(now, that reminds me, I need to book my knee appointment)-- bs0u0155, May 20 2014 Believe me, I've debated with myself about the wisdom of exercising a lot. Mostly while I'm exercising. Here's my conclusion.
The body is about 20,000 years behind the times. It thinks we're getting our food by running around killing it or picking it off a bush. It also thinks once we're done hunting and being worth something to the tribe, it's time to get out of the way and leave the food supply to the strong and vital who are still reproducing. Best way to do that is to die. If it senses that you're not moving, it assumes you're no longer hunting and gathering, therefore, are not doing anything for the group except consuming. Harden those arteries, loose those teeth, soften those un- necessary muscles and get out of the way.
So, exercising, I'm giving my body the message that I'm still doing the only thing that's important in life: running around and killing stuff to eat. Therefore it grants me a reprieve from caveman retirement, namely being thrown in a hole far enough away from camp that I don't stink and put people off their mammoth steaks.
That's the theory anyway. I'm not even sure cavemen died earlier than we did. If they lived longer, it might turn out to be because they never exercised in which case, joke's on me. Anyway, today's a long run day so no more putting it off by tinkering on the internet. Time to get that mantra going.-- doctorremulac3, May 20 2014 But it's not exercise per se that's unenjoyable. Trampolinists and some cyclists look like they're having fun, runners don't.-- hippo, May 20 2014 That's actually quite profound, [hip].
Query: runner <=> masochist ?-- 8th of 7, May 20 2014 // it might turn out to be because they never exercised//
It depends what you mean by exercise. I find it unlikely they went leisure-jogging, plausible they had a bit of a splash about in the river, near certain there was some play with the kids. I'm convinced they'd have a pretty solid metabolic workout though. Huge gluts of food one month, a couple of leaves the next. Sweltering heat for a bit, biting cold the next.-- bs0u0155, May 20 2014 Along [dre]'s lines of postulation, our ancestors' ancestors probably spent a fair amount of time running _away_ from animals: not particularly fun.
I recently read that hunter/gatherers only spend a few hours a day hunting/gathering. Modern society sucks.
My brain persists in parsing the Title as "Office of Entrail Disbursement".-- FlyingToaster, May 20 2014 // hunter/gatherers only spend a few hours a day hunting/gathering//
and probably a couple of months per year huddled in a cave, shivering, living off body fat from better times.-- bs0u0155, May 20 2014 I'll admit, basing a health regime on something I "seem to remember reading somewhere" about cavemen is probably a little lacking in logic. And the thing about exercising to fool your body into thinking you're still a hunter worthy of living is my theory as far as I know. Total time spent on research: A couple of minutes. Sources cited? See above.
But hey, everybody's doing it so it can't be all bad.-- doctorremulac3, May 20 2014 ^^No doubt, though I believe winter simply equals much more hunting and much less gathering.-- FlyingToaster, May 20 2014 //everybody's doing it so it can't be all bad //
... like dying of bubonic plague, cholera, smallpox, tuberculosis, diptheria ... ?-- 8th of 7, May 20 2014 // I'm not even sure cavemen died earlier than we did.//
Yes they did. The died thousands of years earlier than we did.-- MaxwellBuchanan, May 20 2014 He's right, you know.-- 8th of 7, May 20 2014 Goodbye, [bigs]. It was nice knowing you. We hope it's quick and painless ... say "Hi" for us when the Men In Black come for you ...-- 8th of 7, May 20 2014 I wonder if there isn't a research grant in this, albeit one relating to ethically questionable research. The OCD should come up with a range of potentially plausible conspiracies and release them into the wild in an effort to determine the characteristics of what loonies will believe. If nothing sticks, the next research project is to see how much bolstering a given conspiracy needs before it becomes self perpetuating. Trial viruses, you could call them. Then to stage three: the metaconspiracy wherein the government is able to shape sub rosa policy in a way that is undetectable by the now adequately mapped and modelled susceptible mind.-- calum, May 20 2014 ... and they're coming for you as well, [cal] ...-- 8th of 7, May 20 2014 //a research grant in this, albeit one relating to ethically questionable research//
You show me, I'll bang in a grant application. Presumably there's grant money the PI's dark Range Rover with darker windows? Got to look sinister if you're doing Ethically Questionable Research.-- bs0u0155, May 20 2014 //bolstering a given conspiracy needs before it becomes self perpetuating//
If you can combine a government conspiracy with a cat video, you'll have terrific virulence...-- bs0u0155, May 20 2014 Pure undiluted amoral evil that would make a Bond supevillain blench, married to lethargy and incompetence tha would be funny if it weren't lavishly funded by the taxpayer ... what's not to like ?-- 8th of 7, May 20 2014 I like "blench". A hybrid of blanch and bench (like sent to the bench, in favor of the whippersnapper who barely knows which side of the ball is up). Overtones of belch.-- bungston, May 21 2014 If this were to be implemented, I would want to have injectors in the engines that would inject water every 2-3 seconds to give a definitive "donut-on-a-rope" appearance. We can capture the "Project Aurora" crowd at the same time. To really make them go bat-shite-crazy, alternate oil and water injection to make alternating oil/water vapor donuts. Should be a nice effect.
I remember going to SUN 'n FUN in Florida and one of the aerial stunt fliers had his sponsor's cologne in his smoke oil. Every time he buzzed the field, a hint of Old Spice wafted over the crowd. I doubt that it would drift down from the flight levels, but it might be worth a try to drum up corporate sponsorship to fund the program...?-- Klaatu, May 21 2014 As used by Robert Duvall ...-- 8th of 7, May 22 2014 [doctorremulac3], Hey you missed the San Fran half-con at my house. Was that intentional or was there something else more sinister at work, that kept you from attending??? As for the idea, this would just fan the flames of my all too active. existing paranoia. (But wait, I'll out smart you and give you a bun, least you come for me in some strange cyber way) +-- blissmiss, May 22 2014 I'm all for this: I'm looking forward to Phil the Greek's deathbed confession.-- Gordon Comstock, May 22 2014 Whoo hooo. Hi Gordon!-- blissmiss, May 22 2014 What's a half-con?
I'm a friendly cyber entity, Barney the dinosaur's my hero. No need to give buns for appeasement.
Besides, it's not about the buns, it's about sparking interesting conversation/debate/flame wars etc. I don't think anybody's really inventing anything here.-- doctorremulac3, May 22 2014 hey [doc-rem] way back up there I will agree with you that maybe I have given the gov't. WAY too much credit for being clever. My issue is that not all this hullaballo is being done by any such gov't. There are other people who rule the world. We don't know them and I don't trust them. I don't actually believe all the conspiracy theories, as there are far too many.( Many of which condradict each other.)
I think your idea is funny is witty, but really won't shut up the conspiracy nuts. That is why my bone will stay there. I actually like the idea, but don't agree with the outcome.-- xandram, May 22 2014 Bone cheerfully acknowledged. :)-- doctorremulac3, May 22 2014 A half-con is the equivalent to a couple bakers meeting up and getting together and calling it a convention. Sometimes it's nervous and awkward as jutta says, and sometimes it's just beverages and laughter as in the London piss-ups. We have pictures of the one at my house somewhere. I shall link. ( We mostly did hawk watching at mine, but briefly connected with a fellow baker across the pond, and jutta baked yummy, homemade croissants.)
And I think there have been quite a few inventions that have been baked in the real world from here, and quite successfully. Don't know off the top of my head which ones. but there have been some that have been patented. (I don't live in San Francisco any longer by the way, but I left my heart there, for sure. )-- blissmiss, May 22 2014 I'd like to see the pics. Sounds like you guys have fun.
Reading about it I see that the Tech Shop maker fairs are frequented by HBers. That's definately my happy place. Learned how to use the CNC milling machines, 3D controller programs, plasma cutter, vacuum former to name just a few items I got trained on. It's prototype heaven there. Was once in the Bay Area only, now it's nation wide.-- doctorremulac3, May 22 2014 They are posted under the link section. Scroll down a few. You will see us.-- blissmiss, May 22 2014 All these years and I've never once clicked on the link section. I'll check it out.-- doctorremulac3, May 22 2014 Wow! There's a whole world of incredibly awesome links in that links thing. Thanks Bliss!-- doctorremulac3, May 22 2014 //Well then who f--k is "THEY"
[third person plural]
Used to refer to two or more people or things previously mentioned or easily identified: "the two men could get life sentences if they are convicted"
OED-- not_morrison_rm, May 23 2014 You betcha, you betcha, [doctorremulac3].-- blissmiss, May 23 2014 random, halfbakery