I hate being stung by wasps, pestered by ants, frightened by spiders, nudged by bees etc but as a vegan and advocate of animal rights I experience a real moral dilemma when poised over an ant's nest with a kettle of boiling water in my trembling hands. Sure I can catch spiders and wasps in a glass-and-postcard trap but the problem is I can only run so far before I release them and this can only provide a temporary solution. In particular our house seems to be revisited frequently by what I can only describe as a gigantic homing-spider who is immune to my enforced relocation technique. Given that my neighbours are (human) animals too it seems morally inconsistent to spare the wasp only to inflict its stingy ways on them after I throw it over the fence into their garden.
I suggest the solution to this problem lies in the combination of an island somewhere far off the coast and a removal service available for free at point-of-capture.
Having confined the beastie in question in some sort of temporary but non-threatening trap - of which there are many available - I simply dial the 'beastie hotline' and wait. After a short delay in which my conscience remains gloriously untroubled, a brightly-painted van arrives and a friendly and courteous 'beastie helper' transfers the creature into one of the van's luxury compartments for safe removal. Eventually the beastie arrives on 'Beastie Island' - which I picture as a wonderful place with no humans, just swarms of happy insects. Of course the government might have to resort to a compulsory purchase order in order to procure said island, but then who (in the UK) would really miss the Isle-of-Wight or one of the Channel Islands (which have the additional advantage of being nearer to the French)?
Beastie Island would be sealed from the outside world using a variety of barriers appropriate to its inhabitants so as to prevent escape. Genetically Modified foodstuffs would ensure that each species received a plentiful dose of some chemical or other which would inhibit its breeding but not harm it (a bit like garlic for humans). In this way the beasties could live out their lives doing those things they like best (killing and eating each other) without bothering us (well, me).
Of course we would need to re-stock the human habitats with robot pseudo-beasties such as non-stingy bee-bots in order to facilitate pollination for plants that require it but I'm confident the required leap forward in miniaturisation and AI is just around the corner (hand me my nano-spanner please).
There are a number of other uses to which the Island could be put in order to provide a revenue stream to ensure it would be self-financing. For example:
A prison/punishment block could be collocated on the island so that the very worst offenders would be likely to receive a substantial number of 'punishment stings' to go with their sentence of confinement. Now that's what I call a deterrent.
All participants in 'Jackass' could be invited to live there forever in order to fullfil their most macho requirements for self-harm (to the max man).
Big Brother contestants could be sent there following eviction. No real reason I'm just warming to the idea - and now that I can't squash bugs I need an outlet for my aggression.
Initial investment would have to come from the state, but surely a mandatory stint as a 'beastie helper' for all unemployed jobseekers - with the accompanying reduction in unemployment statistics - would provide all the incentive required?
For those nay-sayers who complain that we should have learnt by now not to interfere with the delicate balance of nature's marvellous bio-harmony I say that this idea actually reinforces their position. Surely by our repeated use of insecticides we only provide the ideal environment for the evolution of beastie-strains ever more resistant to our attempts to kill them - and hence initiate the spiral of worse and worse chemicals used to combat each new generation of 'super-bee'? By removing the creatures instead of trying to poison them we at least preserve them so that if the whole scheme proves to be a failure we can just release them back into the community (via a half-way house of course - maybe Scotland?)-- dobtabulous, Aug 18 2003 It could happen http://www.geocitie...mb_wax/antzilla.htm [thumbwax, Oct 04 2004, last modified Oct 06 2004] Maybe Beaster Island?-- bristolz, Aug 18 2003 Beastie Island suggestion: The Isle of Man - no human animals there, ironically.-- my face your, Aug 18 2003 [mfy]: Are you saying The Isle of Man isn't populated?-- snarfyguy, Aug 18 2003 It's populated alright. It's populated by subhuman freaks. And Ken Dodd.-- my face your, Aug 18 2003 Isn't Ken Dodd dead?-- hazel, Aug 18 2003 No. You're thinking of his Dad's dog.-- Jinbish, Aug 18 2003 [ravenswood] - would they fight for the right for larvae?-- dobtabulous, Aug 18 2003 Whilst sympathising with your desire to avoid vicious, wicked and stingy insects I'm against the forced deportation of spiders. However, I am in favour of irritating the French. Overall fishcake.-- DrBob, Aug 18 2003 <Fast Show> They don't have deviants on the Isle of Man </Fast Show>-- oneoffdave, Aug 18 2003 Miniaturasic Park?-- FarmerJohn, Aug 18 2003 It could be built around France and include the people.-- Shz, Aug 18 2003 I was tempted to croissant this idea just for the "gigantic homing-spider" bit, but I regained my senses a few paragraphs later.-- Jezzie, Aug 18 2003 Nope, gigantic homing spider gets the bun from me. I think this idea should be pared back to just the bits about the gigantic homing spider.-- bungston, Aug 18 2003 surely [toejam] you can imagine the earning potential for an island full of hateful beasties?
Collection has to be a free service to achieve the required market penetration otherwise those who opt out will simply throw their beasties into my garden and my expense will be wasted.
Given the popularity of the french-bashing and spider parts of this idea perhaps I should reformat it as 'Repatriate all French people using gigantic homing spiders to catch them'?-- dobtabulous, Aug 19 2003 Wouldn't the frogs eat up all the bugs?-- FarmerJohn, Aug 19 2003 [FarmerJohn] If you are talking about real frogs then their bug consumption would be no problem for me. And if it became one, there's always "Frog Island" to send them to....
If you are talking about my European neighbours then I think they specialise in frog’s legs and horsemeat rather than bugs?-- dobtabulous, Aug 19 2003 I think England's just about the right size for this.....-- energy guy, Aug 26 2004 thanks, mate!-- po, Aug 26 2004 I suppose if all insects were taken out of the environment that just happened to be at your house, the only surviving insects would be the ones that avoid humans. Therefore, through darwin's theory, the only insects in populated areas would evolve to avoid humans. One insect-covered deported bun for you!-- destructionism, Aug 26 2004 Today in the news: Dobtabulous, self-proclaimed vegan and animal rights exponent, forced to admit eliminating entire levels of food chain may have caused beloved animals some difficulty.
Scratches head in response to question of how scores of dead bug-deprived birds somehow morally superior to nice juicy steak. [-]-- DocBrown, Aug 27 2004 Good point [Doc] it would be morally wrong to act as you describe. However I don't think I'm advocating the elimination of an entire level of the food chain - merely the humane relocation of portions of it from human-populated areas to the island. I agree though that we'd have to keep a close watch on the health of e.g. the bird population and reverse the process if we found negative side-effects. Remember that my method is an alternative to killing the bug in question so in theory it would only impact on those animals which would otherwise have fed on the dead bug's body - which the murderer would probably have put into the bin and ended up in a sealed bin bag.
And aren't all vegans (or for that matter ballet-dancers or football fans) self-confessed? The adjective always has a derogatory air!-- dobtabulous, Aug 27 2004 Hmmm...points for the measured response (with the exception of the word 'murderer' - I would have let you have 'killer' but 'murder' is the killing of a human being, further distinguished by the unlawful nature of the killing).
I think what you're talking about is the elimination of certain levels of the food chain. True, only within human-populated areas, but considering the area occupied by humans these days and the consequential sharing of territory with birds and animals, this would have a big effect. I don't buy your argument about only affecting those animals that feed on dead bugs either - your idea is also an alternative to local relocation and so would affect animals and birds that feed on live insects by depriving them of food.
As to the "self-confessed" part: no, obviously not all vegans or football fans are self-confessed. I might be a football fan and/or a vegan, but since I haven't announced this, I'm not known to be either of these.
The derogatory air is usually intentional and meant to indicate hypocrisy on the part of the self-confessor. In this instance, it was used because you declared you are a vegan and animal rights advocate, yet you're propounding an idea that would appear to run counter to the ideals of your stated alignments.
Good debate.-- DocBrown, Aug 27 2004 Thanks for the points [Doc]. Yes "murderer" was far from "measured" - but a little light-hearted provocation seems a more attractive alternative than the outright evangelism I object to in many pro-animal-rights advocates.
On reflection you are quite right - I'd forgotton the local-relocation aspect. The only way I can think of to fix this would be to make my replacement 'robot pseudo-beasties' have some nutritional value for the feeders - but I think I've stretched this idea *well* beyond the bounds of credulity already so I think I'll give up now and concede.
Interesting to debate the difference between "self-confessed" and "self-proclaimed". The former presumably indicating the declaration of an attribute which is negative and might be the substance of a 'confession', the latter of a more positive 'proclamation'? I guess if I concede the anti-animal consequences of my idea then I can't really quarrel with your use of the former.
Good Debate indeed.-- dobtabulous, Aug 27 2004 I'd have a different take on the "confessed/proclaimed" thing: 'proclaimed' suggests that a statement has been made, without questioning being applied to the statement maker.'Confessed' suggests that a question was asked, which forced the confessor to erm...confess to their view/opinion/belief.
So I'd say that whilst both descriptions can be applied to someone in a negative manner, "self-proclaimed" would be more apt in cases where hypocrisy is evident because what's usually happened is someone has declared a belief and then said something in opposition to that belief; rather than somebody putting forth an idea which they later admit is against a principle or whatnot.
Anyway big pluses to you for the level-headed debating. Too many of your dreadlocked, soap dodging brethren (hey, I've got to have something if you get to have murderer!)are so quick to play the "Meat is Murder" card in place of a civilised, logical debate that they alienate alot of people that might otherwise be sympathetic to their cause.
Hope to bun your next idea. No animal products will be used in the making of the bun.-- DocBrown, Aug 27 2004 // dreadlocked, soap dodging brethren //
Funny.-- dobtabulous, Aug 27 2004 <Jinbish>
// No. You're thinking of his Dad's dog.//
Near laughed my cock off. Brilliant.-- etherman, Aug 27 2004 Me, I have signed a mutual non-agression pact with the beastie kingdom and it works fine. I have a grapevine visited by a zillion wasps and none even thinks of using is sting on me, vipers will not bite me and spiders love to inspect my hands. Live and let live, I say - except for the french. That part I subscribe. "French Island". But if you move the beasties to France, they will inmediatly be drenched in some sauce and eaten. Say, what's all that about Dad's dog who died?. And went to Heaven?.-- finflazo, Aug 27 2004 I would prefer not to be the one to break our ancient non-aggression pact with the arthropods. You know, the one where we agree to let them go on doing all the hard agricultural work, and in return they don't swarm and destroy us with their superior numbers?-- GutPunchLullabies, Aug 27 2004 Spaniards, bad, bad. Ils sont des fous et assasinent les pauvres taureaux. E os portugueses tambén nao sao muito bons. Il faudrait tout cercler with a wall like the one on China. Well, since we're at it, we could emprison the Chinese, too. Fot un fret qu'arruga la pel dals pabrots.-- finflazo, Aug 27 2004 (bwv) (sounds like a german motorcycle brand) Hey!. Eu sou um Espanhol duma figa ! . Devo dizer que a mais bela cidade que eu conheço poder ser Lisboa ! . Eu tinha lá uma namorada ... faz muito tempo, certamente . Ja nem me lembro da lingua. (Do idioma, nao estejas a pensar). Em Portugal ainda fica un bocado do meu coraçao. Anyway the crockoaches just broke the nonagression pact, overpowered and tied up the dogs and helped themselves to the dog's food. Time for DDT.-- finflazo, Aug 28 2004 [etherman]: Cheers! I'm just glad someone got it.-- Jinbish, Aug 28 2004 This reminds me of the time I was in high school spanish. I'd put words together in no apparent order (mostly because I had no idea what they meant). My favorite one was...la semana pasada tostada manana. I think it translates into "I'm giving a report on tostadas tomorrow". Just another effort to avoid responsibility.-- destructionism, Aug 28 2004 (destruct) I find it extremely hard to translate your Spanish. Must be good ! . Something vERY deep...
(bwv) OK (Magna Carta) You're entitled, but it is not mutual, and I've been to New York, and it's...undescrpitible. I guess somebody likes it. Lisbon is my cup of tea.-- finflazo, Aug 29 2004 This would deprive me of the pleasure of using a hand-cranked Gatling to eliminate insect pests. I recommend this method to all.-- AlanS, Aug 29 2004 Gatlingis the best, but I know one who used a compressed air gun to obliterate ants from a sporting distance-- finflazo, Aug 29 2004 This would deprive me of the pleasure of using a hand-cranked Gatling to eliminate insect pests. I recommend this method to all.-- Alan_Sosprach, Aug 29 2004 random, halfbakery