In the UK we have an issue with farmers wanting to kill badgers as they might spread Bovine TB to their cattle. The alternative argument is that increased badger migration (by potentially diseased badger) into this recently cleared area of badger prime real estate, will mean a short lived benefit.
The solution "Badger Jackets". The profits used to breed and relocate healthy TB free badgers for release in recently purged badger populations in cattle areas and purchase land for permanent badger habitats.
Healthier badgers, nice fur coats for happy farmers who will wear their badger coats with pride and a large cull. (not sure of the quality of Badger pelts so they may in fact not be wearing them with pride, but they will enthusiastically purchase them with pride, in support of fellow farmers who seemingly require these culls. If the TB comes back we can just repeat the exercise every year.
And if this doesn't work we could kill the bovine TB infected cattle and wear them as shoes.
I wonder how much a Panda pelt could be worth?-- PainOCommonSense, Oct 12 2012 Stop The Cull details http://www.fwi.co.u...cull-opposition.htm [xenzag, Oct 12 2012] Better not share my name http://www.theregis...bsite_hosted_in_us/UK.gov tries to close site giving home addresses of badger cull figures [PainOCommonSense, Oct 12 2012] Badger pelts 'r' us! http://www.fursourc...ed-skins-p-377.htmlWell, actually they 'r' usa as it happens. They also do sheared beaver. [MaxwellBuchanan, Oct 14 2012] If I saw anyone wearing a coat made out of a badger, I would purchase a large bucket of white paint and empty it over them, followed by a bag of multi coloured "smarties". I suspect others may resort to acts of physical violence leading to bodily harm.-- xenzag, Oct 12 2012 I happen to be wearing shoes made of dead Cow. Can I expect the same level of treatment?-- PainOCommonSense, Oct 12 2012 If cows were a protected species similar to that of the Badger - the answer to that is Yes, only less paint would be needed.-- xenzag, Oct 12 2012 //I'm not so sure about the physical violence// I am certain of it. Animal Rights groups can be very militant, and have used extreme tactics before. Anyone wearing a coat made out of Badger fur/skin is wearing a target and inviting trouble to be visited upon them. This is a bad idea, and attracts my first bone of the week. [-]-- xenzag, Oct 12 2012 Whatever happened to the unpopular because more expensive inoculation option? As to wearing the remains of a culled diseased badger, no thank you.-- Phrontistery, Oct 12 2012 You're talking about killing off a population, making jackets out of them, then reintroducing new, known-healthy badgers to the locale ? Why not sedate them, check them out, rerelease the well ones with a dab of orange paint on them so they aren't reprocessed.
This sounds similar to my scheme for Aussie feral cats: catch, perform vasectomy/tubal-ligation, vaccinate and feed them up, marke them then release.
The healthier sterile cats are still hormone driven and waste/circumvent the breeding efforts of the unfixed ferals, thus the population wanes with minimal effort and no cruelty.-- FlyingToaster, Oct 12 2012 //large bucket of white paint and empty it over//
//with a dab of orange paint//
Why this sudden obsession with painting things?
//...my scheme for Aussie feral cats: catch, perform vasectomy/tubal-ligation, vaccinate and feed them up, marke them then release.//
Female cats mate with multiple males, so sterilising the males is probably not going to make much difference. Your scheme would work if you could sterilise a high enough proportion of the females to drive the population to extinction. That must be quite a high percentage over several generations.-- Loris, Oct 12 2012 yes, but a male in good physical condition (which the sterilized ones will be, having been fixed up and vaccinated) can scare off one in lesser condition.
Mostly though, a sterile female in heat will attract and concentrate suitors from miles around, to all waste their time.
A straight cull has no effect: new feral cats fill the gap. Catch/neuter/release has the advantage of blocking that by occupying the food source. Catch/sterilize/release while keeping hormones intact, not only does that but actively blocks breeding.-- FlyingToaster, Oct 12 2012 Wow that's a lot of bones for Badger Jackets idea, remember I am not supporting the killing of badgers, more trying to turn this cull around to benefit of the badgers, funded by the farmers, but hey if [xenzag] & friends prefers straight and cheap mass slaughter that's also fine by me. I have to say I think the last bit of my suggestion, the purchase of permanent sanctuary for badger populations appears to have been glossed over.
Unfortunately the [Phrontistery] idea to immunise has only been adopted in Wales not the rest of the UK. This idea is more of a farmer funded scheme to profit from the cull and purchase land. The aim is not to hold down the badger population, ala sterile males.
As a compromise, I felt that it was much better than just plain killing them and allowing the disease to come back via badger migration. However if you prefer not to allow other people to wear the dead fur of a badger that has already been killed as part of the cull, that's fine. I can't see how wearing them is going to make matters worse. btw turns out that those premium shaving brushes that folks give their dads on fathers day are made from Badger fur. Not sure how they get the fur but hopefully some of the residual badger carcasses will server some practical purpose there.-- PainOCommonSense, Oct 12 2012 Badger fur shaving brushes are generally made from badgers bred in China. They aren't the usual black and white sort we get here, but still badgers. Even brushes 'made in England' aren't from British fur because of the illegality of capturing badgers (even without killing them).-- TomP, Oct 12 2012 Thanks Tom I feel more relaxed in the knowledge that someone else's badgers are being used. Particularly liked the commend covering off the removal of fur from live animals scenario.
The response reminds me a little of the research into the cat impact on bird populations...death threats to the statistician that was going to check, before he even suggested a conclusion. (mental note better not print a T-shirt with my idea ala Barry Thew.)-- PainOCommonSense, Oct 12 2012 //...badger carcasses will [serve] some practical purpose...//
PULL!!!
<BANG>
And maybe you could alternate with some of [Max]'s moles; he seems to have plenty of those... [+]-- Grogster, Oct 12 2012 [+] not only because we like the idea but because it upsets sandal-wearing Guardian- reading vegetarians who have probably never been within a kilometre of a real farm in their entire valueless lives.-- 8th of 7, Oct 12 2012 //I can't see how wearing them is going to make matters worse.// If you create a demand you will create an industry. Simple economics. One of the fishbones is mine. Well, it was mine. It's yours now, obviously. Wear it with pride..unlike your badger jacket!-- DrBob, Oct 12 2012 For the record I really like badgers ! and live very near the country side and would rather not have to have them killed. they grunt like pigs and are very flat and move like you would not believe.-- PainOCommonSense, Oct 12 2012 //Innoculate the cows...that seems astoundingly easy// or stop eating them, which is easier again.-- xenzag, Oct 12 2012 Saw an opossum the other day.
I still don't see how making badger coats has anything to do with introducing fresh badgers to a culled area.-- FlyingToaster, Oct 12 2012 The Govt cant afford to inoculate apparently, but the farmers feel very strongly about this. They already look like tweed wearing idiots, now they get to wear badger fur. Their country side alliance friends can support them by buying fur jackets and we spend the money repopulating the purged areas and purchasing special land for free breeding for perpetuity, all funded by the extravagant fur trade and bizarrely strong support for all things countryside-alliance related.-- PainOCommonSense, Oct 12 2012 //but the farmers feel very strongly about this// Many more non-farmers feel even stronger, including several experts who have asserted that the cull won't work and in fact will exacerbate the problem for many reasons.
I actually have a better idea.... cull the farmers instead.-- xenzag, Oct 14 2012 Badgers hold a special place in the psyche, which perhaps can only be understood by those who have grown up with classics such as Wind in The Willows.-- xenzag, Oct 14 2012 Possibly as distinct from those who have grown up with classics such as badgers.-- MaxwellBuchanan, Oct 14 2012 //I actually have a better idea.... cull the farmers instead//
I hope you are the sort of person who grows all of their own food, or barters with the next-door smallholder.
//Badgers hold a special place in the psyche, which perhaps can only be understood by those who have grown up with classics such as Wind in The Willows.//
Also, please say you're not the sort who won't eat rabbit because of Beatrix Potter.-- TomP, Oct 15 2012 I think there is a difference between refusing to eat a certain animal because it is too cute-looking, and objecting to a wholesale cull of a certain animal saving the meat growing industry from cleaning up its operations.-- pocmloc, Oct 15 2012 ^^ That's a fair point, but what I mean is that the reasons for supporting such a scheme or not should be mainly based on reason and logic rather than a cuteness factor. The former is the reason why I'm not a fan of the scheme, while 'Wind in the Willows', despite being a childhood favourite, is a negligable factor; rather like one of the less significant terms that are left out in a binomial approximation.
I still agree with the original point of the idea which is to make the best of a bad situation.-- TomP, Oct 15 2012 // meat growing industry //
Bovine TB is mainly a problem for dairy farmers.
Your manifest unfamiliarity with the facts of the situation does not help in reinforcing your opinion. This is generically true; for your argument to carry weight, you must be able to quote irrefutable facts and demonstrate a clear and objective view of the overall situation.-- 8th of 7, Oct 15 2012 //should be mainly based on reason and logic //
I agree. I occasionally rub professional shoulders with ecologists and conservationists. I am impressed that, more often than not, they are very hard-nosed and hard-science. They generally don't do cutesy and, if all the sharks were starving to death and the only available food was badgers, I think there would be fewer badgers.-- MaxwellBuchanan, Oct 15 2012 //please say you're not the sort who won't eat rabbit because of Beatrix Potter.// I won't eat rabbit because of Beatrix Potter. (actually I haven't eaten any meat in more than 25 years)-- xenzag, Oct 15 2012 //manifest unfamiliarity with the facts of the situation// I wasn't referring to a particular situation, I was generalising hypothetically.-- pocmloc, Oct 15 2012 There are several people and dining societies who have, over the centuries, tried to eat their way through as broad a phylogeny as possible.
I think it may be well worth instigating the Beatrix Potter Dining Society, with the express purpose of eating its way through the characters in the books of Ms. Potter, Gavin Maxwell, Richard Adams (not much culinobiodiversity there, granted), Walt Disney, and others of that ilk. Or elk.-- MaxwellBuchanan, Oct 16 2012 //... dining societies who have, over the centuries, tried to eat their way through as broad a phylogeny as possible.//
On TV, I once saw part of a speech made at such a gathering - IIRC they called themselves the carnivore society. The guy stated that he wanted to eat a vegetarian. I decided that if I got the chance to prepare him a meal I could serve human black pudding. It would be interesting to see whether he'd actually eat it or it was just bluster.-- Loris, Oct 17 2012 I thought that was discussed and everyone, but [hippo] in particular, conceded to my main remarks that 1) it is frivolous if the nutriment is derived from one's own body 2) it develops a taste for human flesh 3) blood products are scarce and best used to heal the injured.-- rcarty, Oct 17 2012 //develops a taste for human flesh//
I don't see the harm in that. I have a taste for beef but I don't go out shooting cattle.-- MaxwellBuchanan, Oct 17 2012 Well, at least not deliberately. Or was that Sturton again ?
We understand that placentae are consumed by some members of your species. Since this is a protein source that would otherwise be discarded, and causes no harm to the organism producing it (having fulfilled its purpose, it is superfluous), there are no moral or ethical issues surrounding its consumption; only the "EEEeeeeeewwwww" factor.-- 8th of 7, Oct 17 2012 You see the harm and present an argument wherein you lie!-- rcarty, Oct 17 2012 I would question the hygiene factor in placenta consumption, given that the staff have more pressing concerns than your dinner.
I have heard and seen first hand of many people who seem to have the urge to nibble on their own scabs, dried nasal discharge and spots. Nutritionally do you think perhaps humans evolved this desire, as a form of nutritional supplement?-- PainOCommonSense, Oct 18 2012 It may also be that nibbling the products of an infected wound might possibly, by administering the same bacteria orally, stimulate some kind of immune reaction.
At the same time, though, eating anyone _else's_ placenta is probably a bad idea, disease-wise.-- MaxwellBuchanan, Oct 18 2012 random, halfbakery